Oh please don't leave us hanging. 
Karl
Civil discussions in person?
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C.R. Krieger
- Posts: 14507
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
- Location: Halfway up the left side of Lake Michigan
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Well, ya deserved that, ya dumbass ...Coldswede wrote:I've never heard a cross word at one of the get 5er together's I have attended ...
I guess me doing a sloppy take off and sloshing hot coffee in TimK's crotch might come close though.
I'm reminded that Chris and I have hurled a few invectives toward one another - but I'd still have a beer with him in a nanosecond.
In person I think it's easier to quickly differentiate between someone willing to openly and level headedly discuss ideas and someone who just wants to beat me over the head with their particular ideology.
The second type of person I don't generally engage in real life unless they say something truly outrageous that I can easily refute/disprove while remaining calm. This makes me very quiet at family gatherings sometimes. Some jerk* always wants to bring politics to the table, and I refuse to debate politics with family. I don't want to have a heated argument at Christmas/Thanksgiving dinner, particularly since I only see them once or twice a year.
Jeremy
* There's usually at least one of these in every family I think.
The second type of person I don't generally engage in real life unless they say something truly outrageous that I can easily refute/disprove while remaining calm. This makes me very quiet at family gatherings sometimes. Some jerk* always wants to bring politics to the table, and I refuse to debate politics with family. I don't want to have a heated argument at Christmas/Thanksgiving dinner, particularly since I only see them once or twice a year.
Jeremy
* There's usually at least one of these in every family I think.
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C.R. Krieger
- Posts: 14507
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
- Location: Halfway up the left side of Lake Michigan
- Contact:
I try to avoid political discussion in person, particularly around family, unless I know the person I'm talking to is capable of having a reasonable conversation. I also avoid discussion when someone is clearly more knowledgeable about the particular subject than I.
I try to avoid political discussion on here as well, but I'm not as successful most of the time.
I try to avoid political discussion on here as well, but I'm not as successful most of the time.
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RangerGress
- Posts: 678
- Joined: Jan 20, 2012 3:15 PM
- Location: Savannah, GA
- Contact:
Lol, awesome.Kenny Blankenship wrote:I never did like Mike. Every time I see him he espouses these leftist radical ideas and it just gets my blood boiling. In fact, I recall this recent conversation with him when I saw him at the last Wrenchfest:
KENNY B: Well, I am an E23 owner!
MIKE W: Oh E23 owner, eh, very nice. And how d'you get that, eh? By exploiting the workers! By 'anging on to outdated imperialist dogma which perpetuates the economic and social differences in our society. If there's ever going to be any progress with the--
JAY 3: I didn't know we had an E23 owner. I thought we were an auto collective.
MIKE W: You're fooling yourself. We're living in a dictatorship. A self-perpetuating autocracy in which the working classes--
MIKE W: I told you. We're an anarcho-syndicalist commune. We take it in turns to act as a sort of executive officer for the week. But all the decision of that officer have to be ratified at a special bi-weekly meeting-- By a simple majority in the case of purely internal affairs,-- But by a two-thirds majority in the case of more major--
JAY 3: Well, how did you become an E23 owner then?
KENNY B: The Lady of the Lake,... [angels sing] ...her arm clad in the purest shimmering samite, held aloft The Roundel from the bosom of the water signifying by Divine Providence that I, Kenny B, was to carry The Roundel. [singing stops] That is why I am an E23 owner!
MIKE W: Listen, strange women lying in ponds distributing Roundels is no basis for a system of government. Supreme executive power derives from a mandate from the masses, not from some farcical aquatic ceremony.
KENNY B: Be quiet!
MIKE W: Well, but you can't expect to wield supreme executive power just 'cause some watery tart threw a Roundel at you!
KENNY B: Shut up!
MIKE W: I mean, if I went 'round saying I was an E23 owner just because some moistened bint had lobbed a Roundel at me, they'd put me away!
KENNY B: Shut up, will you. Shut up!
MIKE W: Ah, now we see the violence inherent in the system.
KENNY B: Shut up!
MIKE W: Oh! Come and see the violence inherent in the system! Help, help! I'm being repressed!
KENNY B: Bloody peasant!
MIKE W: Oh, what a give-away. Did you hear that? Did you hear that, eh? That's what I'm on about. Did you see him repressing me? You saw it, didn't you?
I HATE SPAAAAAAAMMMM!!!
The Internet is more anonymous than most places. Sure, once a person "joins" a community like a forum there are community "trappings" that mitigate the consequence-free world of anonymity, but you know what I mean.
I feel strongly that you really find out what a guy is made of when you observe his behavior when he feels he is free of consequences.
In the paddock I tend to be, or at least certainly try to be, a center of fun. I am always looking for ways to make the newbies feel welcome, to make sure the folks that need help, be it parts, track or repair guidance, labor, or if their GF is simply lonely....one way or another I try to make sure that everyone is getting the help they need. If I don't have the part needed, I go looking for it. The newby isn't going to know the other 25 SpecE30 drivers so he'd be hesitant to go from trailer to trailer to find it. Or if there is some major work to be done, I go to the trailers that have useful folks and tell them "we're replacing Joe's clutch in 30min. Be there".
When I joined SpecE30 a lot of guys worked hard to help me. Most of them are gone now, but I'm absolutely determined to see that tradition, that feeling of a bunch of best friends racing against each other, continue. The reason I'm going into this detail is SpecE30 largely defines my forum and car guy "existence" because I'm usually at SpecE30.com and Bimmerforums.
As a car guy, I've never fenced words with a soul. I'm the guy with the big smile, offering a beer to you with one hand and bringing my socket set with the other so we can break the track record for replacing a broken rocker arm.
I am a hardcore optimist, can usually find the communication problem causing some disagreement, and and would rather make the other guy happy than attempt to prove I'm right.
I spent my whole adult life in the military. I still get a lot of exercise. What I've lost in the suppleness of youth make up for in the sheer meanness that remains after the baby fat of youth disappears. I don't think of myself as a big scary guy, I think of myself as a happily vain, marginally useful, broken down has-been, good for the occasional one-liner.
The sum of all of that is...in person I'm always treated in an entirely friendly manner.
Which is why, when I'm treated poorly in a forum, the desire is overwhelming to fly to the guy's house and beat the shit out of him. I am very intolerant of disrespectful behavior in a forum. When I see one guy badmouthing another, I pigeonhole that guy as a shithead. If you can't disagree with someone else respectfully, than gtfo (get the f out).
When I first came to this forum, there was a guy or two that were less than cordial. I was not happy about that and almost dumped this place as an apparent bunch of shitheads that I didn't want to hang out with. If any of you have hung around Corner-Carvers a bit, dang they can be rough too.
If someone has some meanness skulking behind their day-to-day facade, it comes out in the relative anonymity of the Internet. Likewise, if someone is genuinely a good and considerate person, that comes out too.
I would encourage you to challenge yourself to always be respectful on the Internet. Your every sentence tells people who you really are. Your every kindness and criticism adds to or damages the community that you're hanging out with. Excuses like "he's just grumpy", "crusty", "he's really nice in person", are all just crap. The anonymous you, our measure of the anonymous you, is the real "you". Be worth something.
The Internet forum. A window into your soul. <==RangerGress, 17Dec12, re-use authorized with reasonable attribution.
Last edited by RangerGress on Dec 17, 2012 5:52 PM, edited 1 time in total.
I want to shake your hand.
Everyone wants to "look over there!" with funny stories, bacon, and beer...
That doesn't make up for the fact that a lot of people have been VERY ugly to each other here, of late. No one wants to own up. It's cool, you know who you are. Unfortunately, many other people do, too.
Yeah, yeah, I know. You don't care what other people think about you. Well, in this case, maybe you should.
Everyone wants to "look over there!" with funny stories, bacon, and beer...
That doesn't make up for the fact that a lot of people have been VERY ugly to each other here, of late. No one wants to own up. It's cool, you know who you are. Unfortunately, many other people do, too.
Yeah, yeah, I know. You don't care what other people think about you. Well, in this case, maybe you should.
I don't know if the forum has a post of the year, but it should if it doesn't and I'd like to nominate this one. Amen and well said. All of the fights that occur here keep a lot of people in the woodwork. I'm glad you stepped out and made this statement.RangerGress wrote:
The Internet is more anonymous than most places. Sure, once a person "joins" a community like a forum there are community "trappings" that mitigate the consequence-free world of anonymity, but you know what I mean.
I feel strongly that you really find out what a guy is made of when you observe his behavior when he feels he is free of consequences.
In the paddock I tend to be, or at least certainly try to be, a center of fun. I am always looking for ways to make the newbies feel welcome, to make sure the folks that need help, be it parts, track or repair guidance, labor, or if their GF is simply lonely....one way or another I try to make sure that everyone is getting the help they need. If I don't have the part needed, I go looking for it. The newby isn't going to know the other 25 SpecE30 drivers so he'd be hesitant to go from trailer to trailer to find it. Or if there is some major work to be done, I go to the trailers that have useful folks and tell them "we're replacing Joe's clutch in 30min. Be there".
When I joined SpecE30 a lot of guys worked hard to help me. Most of them are gone now, but I'm absolutely determined to see that tradition, that feeling of a bunch of best friends racing against each other, continue. The reason I'm going into this detail is SpecE30 largely defines my forum and car guy "existence" because I'm usually at SpecE30.com and Bimmerforums.
As a car guy, I've never fenced words with a soul. I'm the guy with the big smile, offering a beer to you with one hand and bringing my socket set with the other so we can break the track record for replacing a broken rocker arm.
I am a hardcore optimist, can usually find the communication problem causing some disagreement, and and would rather make the other guy happy than attempt to prove I'm right.
I spent my whole adult life in the military. I still get a lot of exercise. What I've lost in the suppleness of youth make up for in the sheer meanness that remains after the baby fat of youth disappears. I don't think of myself as a big scary guy, I think of myself as a happily vain, marginally useful, broken down has-been, good for the occasional one-liner.
The sum of all of that is...in person I'm always treated in an entirely friendly manner.
Which is why, when I'm treated poorly in a forum, the desire is overwhelming to fly to the guy's house and beat the shit out of him. I am very intolerant of disrespectful behavior in a forum. When I see one guy badmouthing another, I pigeonhole that guy as a shithead. If you can't disagree with someone else respectfully, than gtfo (get the f out).
When I first came to this forum, there was a guy or two that were less than cordial. I was not happy about that and almost dumped this place as an apparent bunch of shitheads that I didn't want to hang out with. If any of you have hung around Corner-Carvers a bit, dang they can be rough too.
If someone has some meanness skulking behind their day-to-day facade, it comes out in the relative anonymity of the Internet. Likewise, if someone is genuinely a good and considerate person, that comes out too.
I would encourage you to challenge yourself to always be respectful on the Internet. Your every sentence tells people who you really are. Your every kindness and criticism adds to or damages the community that you're hanging out with. Excuses like "he's just grumpy", "crusty", "he's really nice in person", are all just crap. The anonymous you, our measure of the anonymous you, is the real "you". Be worth something.
The Internet forum. A window into your soul. <==RangerGress, 17Dec12, re-use authorized with reasonable attribution.
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C.R. Krieger
- Posts: 14507
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
- Location: Halfway up the left side of Lake Michigan
- Contact:
I can see who's spent some time in Usenet and who hasn't. I came from there (starting around 1994) and, believe it or not, I was one of the nice guys. It was kind of before cyber-civilization, with roaming bands of barbarians bashing it out, sometimes ransacking and totally destroying a group - just because they could. There was no such thing as 'moderation'. I was one of the few there who always used my name - and I still do here. I don't hide behind a handle.
By comparison, this place is like the garage or paddock where we all hang out. We don't have as nasty a 'politics' section as many forums do because we're (barely) civilized enough to get over things quickly. So out of long-established habit, maybe I'm rougher here than in person. Sometimes, I use crude humor or satire to spice things up because this place could be a stunning bore (like, say, bigcoupe) and I would rather it be entertaining. Through it all, you can bet I won't BS you.
By comparison, this place is like the garage or paddock where we all hang out. We don't have as nasty a 'politics' section as many forums do because we're (barely) civilized enough to get over things quickly. So out of long-established habit, maybe I'm rougher here than in person. Sometimes, I use crude humor or satire to spice things up because this place could be a stunning bore (like, say, bigcoupe) and I would rather it be entertaining. Through it all, you can bet I won't BS you.
Last edited by C.R. Krieger on Dec 17, 2012 9:41 PM, edited 1 time in total.