MyE28.com

I found this last night...thought it was interesting to see the BMW CCA columnists
beloved, and very well-maintained, e30 ///M3 up for bids. Keep in mind this fellow
is a jet engine technician and that will give you some idea of how well this car has been
maintained. If ever there was a used M3 to buy...this might be it! ~0

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayI ... Track=true


[Edit by Tim in N FL on [TIME]1108660757[/TIME]]

Perfect car for a m30 turbo conversion.
Todd

Wonder if he's giving a CCA 10% discount? :-)

Very nice...but does it come with the Bubble? :p

[QUOTE="TCD"]Perfect car for a m30 turbo conversion.
Todd[/QUOTE]

You have NO class...

geez, you would think that they guy could source some center caps.

[QUOTE="Rich in Savannah"]geez, you would think that they guy could source some center caps.

[/QUOTE]

Snatch probably stole 'em for his ratty-ass iX.

[QUOTE="TCD"]Perfect car for a m30 turbo conversion.
Todd[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE="Echo"]You have NO class...[/QUOTE]

Guess you'll really be pissed when I buy one and install a LS1. That S14 motor is absolutley the worst "performance motor" ever. Total POS. No power and horribly unbalanced. It's like driving a great car with a lawn mower engine.

Todd

Guess you'll really be pissed when I buy one and install a LS1. That S14 motor is absolutley the worst "performance motor" ever. Total POS. No power and horribly unbalanced. It's like driving a great car with a lawn mower engine.

Todd

~0 ~0 Don't sugar coat it....tell us how you really feel about it! .....LOL

The e30 M3 will never be a decent street car (if it is setup correctly ). It had one purpose, and that was to win races. For those who take a perfectly good track car and try to make it into a street car, I think it is a total waste. As for the bubble car...from what I've heard, some rich guy bought it and started tracking it. Then, found out it didn't have enough power and bought a high-end 2.5 ($15k) motor for it. Only problem is is that they haven't been able to get the engine running yet !@#$

Damon in STL

[QUOTE="TCD"]Guess you'll really be pissed when I buy one and install a LS1. That S14 motor is absolutley the worst "performance motor" ever. Total POS. No power and horribly unbalanced. It's like driving a great car with a lawn mower engine.

Todd[/QUOTE]

I LOVE this guy! LOL!!

Todd is right about the car, though. Peaky, buzzy engine. So, it was race-bred. Woopideedo. It's not in race trim, is it?

The E30 M3 is so much better of a car with an S50 or S52.

Does anyone recall if Calabrese tracked this car (autocross, D.E., etc)? If I was in the market for one of these e30 ///M3s, I would be seriously interested in checking out his car. I wonder why he didn't post any photos of the interior......hmmm....could be ratty, eh?
Cheers,
Tim

ps.
I'm not a big fan of S(N)atch Carlson in Roundel....maybe his humor and style are lost on me. I always read Calabrese and Rob Siegal's columns, however. I could hang with Rob "the hack mechanic"...seems like one of us

Todd and Shifty comments on the s14 and e30 m3 are totally OTL. The S14 is a purpose built motor (as was the car) that does what it was intended to do better than most...win races. and deliver un-parreleled performance driving pleasure. While clearly not a low-end torque machine, from 4000rpm on up it delivers exceptional and consistent power. It is certainly not as smooth as the 6 cyclinder very similair motor in my M5s, but nontheless I (and most BMW experts) find it be one of the best performance motors/cars BMW ever made (I don't think you can seperate the motor from the car... as they are an intergal package). I've had 3 e30 m3s (still have 2) and while they are not perfect (what car/engine is?) they are awesome cars with a great motor for their intented use.

RoyW wrote:Todd and Shifty comments on the s14 and e30 m3 are totally OTL. The S14 is a purpose built motor (as was the car) that does what it was intended to do better than most...win races. and deliver un-parreleled performance driving pleasure. While clearly not a low-end torque machine, from 4000rpm on up it delivers exceptional and consistent power. It is certainly not as smooth as the 6 cyclinder very similair motor in my M5s, but nontheless I (and most BMW experts) find it be one of the best performance motors/cars BMW ever made (I don't think you can seperate the motor from the car... as they are an intergal package). I've had 3 e30 m3s (still have 2) and while they are not perfect (what car/engine is?) they are awesome cars with a great motor for their intented use.

I know that people have this fascination with the s14 but I fail to understand why! I spent enough time in one to know that when I purchase one the motor will be yanked for a much better powerplant. They are other 4cyl motors that are so much better. I absolutely love the looks of the car. It's fantastic, but the S14 ruins the car for ME!

I urge you to drive something else if you think the s14 delivers

un-parreleled performance driving pleasure

Our e30 with the m20 turbo is so smooth and powerful that it makes the S14 feel anemic and ratty.

Todd

Todd... I do own and drive 2 e28 M5s, a 911 Carrera, and an NSX... and I stand by my statements regarding the e30 M3 with an S14. It's not the most powerful, not the smoothest, but on a road course, when driven by an experienced track driver it is, with the exception of my highly modified track M5, at the top of the list. To each his own I guess.

[QUOTE="RoyW"]Todd... I do own and drive 2 e28 M5s, a 911 Carrera, and an NSX... and I stand by my statements regarding the e30 M3 with an S14. It's not the most powerful, not the smoothest, but on a road course, when driven by an experienced track driver it is, with the exception of my highly modified track M5, at the top of the list. To each his own I guess.[/QUOTE]

Sorry, that was presumptuous of me to suggest that you had not driven other sports cars. Imagine how great that M3 would be with an equal weight 4cyl that had 250hp?

Todd

[QUOTE="TCD"]Perfect car for a m30 turbo conversion.
Todd[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE="Echo"]You have NO class...[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE="TCD"]Guess you'll really be pissed when I buy one and install a LS1. That S14 motor is absolutley the worst "performance motor" ever. Total POS. No power and horribly unbalanced. It's like driving a great car with a lawn mower engine.

Todd[/QUOTE]

Yeah i guess the most winning motor and car in DTM history must really be a POS huh? The entire reason for the E30 M3 being built was to win DTM... Who gives a flying rats ass if its a little buzzy on the street... thats part of the nostalgia. I kind of wish Roberto Ravaglia would fly out from Itally just so he could smack you in the face; maybe beat a little sense into you...



[Edit by Echo on [TIME]1108748827[/TIME]]

Todd.... no problem, makes for good discussion. BTW, the Sport Evolution 3 e30 M3 in Europe was 237 bhp and the ones that were used in the European Touring races in the late 80's were close to 400 bhp. I have a 2.5 that is close to 265hp at the crank (you can see the details on the TMS website, under TMS Service and then 1991 e30 M3) and it feels a lot more like a 6, than a 4...very smooth and lots of giddy-up.

BTW...Echo, lighten up...you make good points, but let's not get to emotional here!

If you ask me, the S14 is a sweet engine for an '02, the S50 a sweet engine for an E30 M3, and, uh. . . not sure what belongs in an E36 M3. Maybe a turbo S50?

[QUOTE="Shifty"]If you ask me, the S14 is a sweet engine for an '02, the S50 a sweet engine for an E30 M3, and, uh. . . not sure what belongs in an E36 M3. Maybe a turbo S50? [/QUOTE]

We have a customer that built a 2002 m20 and has purchased one of our turbo kits. I hope Echo doesn't drop a log when he reads this. The blasphemy of it all.


Todd

Todd, You hit the point of the E30 M3, the weight of the motor. The car is a matched set built to the rules of the racing category when new. Without technological advance since 87 maybe that would still be a great TRACK vehicle, but it was never meant to be a great Road car and technology has provided numerous possibilities for 'upgrades' to improve the roadability of the car.

Here's a hypothetical question:

Let's say someone had an s14 and they wanted to turbocharge it. They do a bit of research and find that they can swap pistons and get the compression ratio down to say 8-8.5 to 1. Then they aquire a used header that can be fabricated into a log style turbo manifold. Next, they size a turbo for it and build a complete intercooled turbo system. And, finally they put together a MegaSquirt system to control it. Would this be a bad thing?

Or, they sell the s14 and buy a good used M20. Then, they aquire a TCD turbo package and install both in the M3 chassis. Next, they replace the hood with a carbon fiber one and possibly other mods to bring the weight back down to that of the original s14 install. And they also use the MegaSquirt system for control. Would this be a equally bad thing or worse even?

Just curious .

Damon in STL

[QUOTE="Damon in STL"]Here's a hypothetical question:

Let's say someone had an s14 and they wanted to turbocharge it. They do a bit of research and find that they can swap pistons and get the compression ratio down to say 8-8.5 to 1. Then they aquire a used header that can be fabricated into a log style turbo manifold. Next, they size a turbo for it and build a complete intercooled turbo system. And, finally they put together a MegaSquirt system to control it. Would this be a bad thing?

Or, they sell the s14 and buy a good used M20. Then, they aquire a TCD turbo package and install both in the M3 chassis. Next, they replace the hood with a carbon fiber one and possibly other mods to bring the weight back down to that of the original s14 install. And they also use the MegaSquirt system for control. Would this be a equally bad thing or worse even?

Just curious .

Damon in STL[/QUOTE]

Both are very bad and ruin the car in the eyes of the purist but would be extremely fun. Either would be a great project. I suspect a turbo s14 would be pretty peaky and dfficult to drive on the track like you intend to do.

Todd

[QUOTE="Shifty"]If you ask me, the S14 is a sweet engine for an '02, the S50 a sweet engine for an E30 M3, and, uh. . . not sure what belongs in an E36 M3. Maybe a turbo S50? [/QUOTE]

Well, I actually agree with Shifty here, but that said ...

In response to Todd's comments: To each his own. I'm not an "S-fourteenista" who cries foul when someone "molests" an E30 M3. But two points:

1) If you want to yank the motor and you know it, either a) get a roller, or b) make sure you have a buyer lined up for your good S14 before you yank it.

2) Remember that we drive old cars, and one reason for many is enjoying the cars as they were built. Yes, I want more power in my 535is. But I love that my 18-year-old fat-cat sedan can hang with many modern cars, is more rewarding to drive, and costs a whole lot less. Part of the S14 appeal is that it was WAY ahead of its time ... Honda now produces a buzzy, high-revving 4-cyl that can clear 200 HP. So what? BMW did it 20 years ago! And that's part of the charm.

That said, someday I'd like to have 2 E30 M3s, one S14 and one Euro S50. The second one is a loooong way off ... the first one is probably 6 months away (see sig pic). That one belongs to a friend of mine, it's history is known , it's just at 100k, and it's perfect. And, "It will be mine. Oh yes ... it will be mine."

-tammer

[QUOTE="TCD"]Both are very bad and ruin the car in the eyes of the purist but would be extremely fun. Either would be a great project. I suspect a turbo s14 would be pretty peaky and dfficult to drive on the track like you intend to do.

Todd[/QUOTE]

I agree ... if you want to mod the M3, go with the turbo M20 or M30 or S50; a lot of the project costs can be re-couped by selling the S14.

Just don't call the motor crappy.

-tammer

[QUOTE="TCD"]Perfect car for a m30 turbo conversion.
Todd[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE="Echo"]You have NO class...[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE="TCD"]Guess you'll really be pissed when I buy one and install a LS1. That S14 motor is absolutley the worst "performance motor" ever. Total POS. No power and horribly unbalanced. It's like driving a great car with a lawn mower engine.

Todd[/QUOTE]
I can't beleve you'd pull the "M" engine!!!!!! ~0