Greetings / New Owner / 535i Resto-Thread

[joeuser999]

Hey all,

I just picked up a 'been sitting' 85 e28 535i, Gunmetal gray & cream/white interior. New aftermarket 5spoke rims, tires & exhaust in 2014, and was probably parked shortly after.

Found that the fuel pump was shot, as was the factory fuel pump wiring... relay tests good, but wires feeding the relay appear shorted (with relay removed, seeing +12v on all 4 harness pins ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ ). Presently running a hotwire to the external pump & will continue to troubleshoot.

Once I had pressure at the rail (& remembered to reconnect the airflow sensor) she started & idled on the first go. On the first 2-mile shakedown run she seems a little sluggish in the bottom end of 2nd gear until above ~3k rpm when she sounds good & pulls. worn clutch? the other gears seem fine so far.

One thing I've not seen others reporting is the roof panel forward of the sun roof cutout, has cracked and delaminated.. seems like some kind of vinyl or bondo applied at the factory as its the original paint. A bunch of cracking and peeling up, exposing bare metal underneath.. It was parked outside & Im sure its from UV + years of freeze/thaw. I'm still wearing nubsauce shorts & not able to post photos atm.

Some other general notes:
Newly renewed items:
battery, belts, oil, oil filter, external fuel pump, in tank fuel pre-pump/hanger, fuel level sender, external fuel pump, fuel filter.

On order items:
water pump, thermostat, e-brake cables

Goodies:
My local salvage yard had several bmws & I scored the following:
4x Style 5 rims from an e34, I also grabbed the original factory steel spare (3 of 4 hub covers were also present)
5x Style 73 rims, 21 spoke, from a 2000s 3 series wagon, including good tires (I will need spacers to run these)
I need to decide which set I'll run & will most likely sell off the others.
I also nabbed a factory jack & lug nut wrench from a 2000s suv, along with a bunch of spare relays from that e34.
I'll probably go back for whatever else will directly bolt on from the e34.

Known issues:
Speedo & tach both inoperable (Same goes for the efficiency meter) & expecting bad pcb in the cluster but still need to troubleshoot
Alternator is charging but weak & noisy, ~13v at idle, replacing it this weekend.
Power steering pump delivers power & is super noisy. Its an expensive swap, so I will nurse it for now.. Any advise on a rebuild or outright swap?
AC pump mounting bracket missing the 19mm gear nut.. bolt appears original & seized so i removed the AC belt for now & will address later.
Power windows not working & need to check that breaker under the dash (fingers crossed).
Strong mildew smell even after removing seats, steam & carpet clean. will try baking soda & need to look into an ozone generator or something else.

Ok, long intro post. Glad to find all this great info & only mildly concerned about the missing/broken SSL certs for this site

Thanks in advance to everyone contributing here!

[Mike W.]

Welcome to the group Joe, I like your ultra specific location and kudos, looks like you've already done some research.

Alternators are absolutely stupid long lasting and reliable, however regulators while not quite a weak link are not so bulletproof, but at least cheap and easy to change. However bad bearings are a possibility.

Power steering pump may very well just be loose bolts holding it together. Odd as it may seem, the bolts can be not quite loose, just not tight, not leak, but allow it to suck air resulting in that growling noise. Try tightening the pump body bolts first.

Not everyone agrees, but my experience with those adjusting gearnuts is they're nice artwork, but they don't work very well. I just use a big screwdriver or crowbar to lever things out.

Speedo and tach I would expect to be a bad SI board as you've already noted.

[joeuser999]

Thanks Mike! I will definitely check those bolts on the power steering pump, along with several other things.

Attempted to attach images of the roof delam issue and they didnt take... so adding links instead

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1oyi4HE ... sp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rkVDeo ... sp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1flGt0o ... sp=sharing

[Mike W.]

Oh, that looks nasty. I don't claim to have seen everything, but I've seen a whole lot of E28s and never seen that. Hailstorm and bondo? Soft roll and bondo? I have no idea.

[joeuser999]

I submit that its a factory skim coat to thicken the roof metal.. either cost savings or stiffening, or some other such madness.. Its definitely under the factory paint so not any kind of repair from what I'm seeing.. we are mid-continent & winters here can be harsh.. ITs been parked outdoors since at least 2014 & probably a lot longer than that.. I'm thinking UV weakened it.. moisture crept in & the freeze thaw cycles caused it to crack up and burst.

Any thoughts on repair? Without any experience with body work my initial though is to break off all the high chips, sand it back and bondo the low areas.. not sure what a respectable body guy would suggest & definitely open to ideas!

[DJM1986-5]

I'm in agreement with Mike. I've never seen anything like that. Possible hail damage repair. The hood and trunk may have been replaced along with- does the hood have a "DOT R" sticker under the nose near the BMW emblem? Just a hunch. Should be taken down to bare metal (remove front and rear glass) and epoxy coated (first process after bare metal), skimmed, primed and repainted including the pillars. Check around the base of both front and rear glass and windshield wiper posts for rust or bubbling as well.

[BMWCCA2]

Looks like a tree fell on its roof at some point. That's some serious (and bad) bodywork.

[e28Sean]

I submit that its a factory skim coat to thicken the roof metal.. ...

Nope. That is not factory. Looks like a bad bondo job. Only way to fix that is to strip it down to metal and fix it again.

[turbodan]

Only thing on the roof from the factory is paint. That's definitely been plastered with something at some point.

[Foonfer]

Not sure what happened to that roof there but... I'm all for saving each and every E28. Nice find!

Next thing is - check for rust in all the known places. Drivetrains are known to be, quote unquote, "bulletproof"... bodies are known to mercilessly rust in many many spots.

[joeuser999]

Well if this isn't the factory treatment, the color match is impeccable, even if the 'bondo' job itself seems to have failed.

In the areas where I can see bare metal, the metal is perfectly smooth aside from surface rust. for now keeping it out of the rain as any permenant body repairs will be well down the line.

The PO gave me several folders full of old service receipts dating back to his purchase in 92 (this is an 85 model).. the rear glass was replaced at one point, and the water pump.., window tint was added.. driveshaft carrier and gwibo replaced at 140k.. i have all the receipts.. No documented evidence of body work anytime after 1992. Also, no DOT R markings under the hood.


New question, Regarding the headliner.
While parked since 2014, mice made it into every conceivable space. I've torn out most of the interior aside from the dash and cleaned everywhere i can reach.. same goes for the boot. Is there a safe/reversable way to partially drop the head liner to inspect the space between the roof and the liner? Odds are good mice have been in there and no plans to pull my windshield anytime soon.. is there a best approach for gaining some access, where if need be i can slide a narrow vacuum hose in there to clean, etc?

I have a number of electrical issues also, windows, power mirrors are inoperable (among other gremlins). The sun roof did move a little when I tapped the button, but at this point I'm reluctant to actually open it, just in case it decides to jam or crap out while open.. not prepared for that rebuild just yet....

So.. for the moment, no access to the headliner/roof space via the sun roof & looking for tips on accessing the space without complete headliner removal.... also need to clean out those sunroof drains as they are undoubtedly clogged

Thanks for all the replies!

[Ibmotoren]

There should be an allen wrench in your trunk tool kit to manually open and close the sunroof if neccesary. Not sure if that applies to 85’s but someone will correct me if not.
For the inop windows, have you first made sure the window breaker switch is in place? It’s in the kick panel in front of your right knee when sitting in the drivers seat. It could be switched off, or not there at all. If not there, the windows will not budge.
The contacts in the side mirror switch can get “dirty”. When I first got my e28 I thought they weren’t working either. After reading up on it, I just kept playing with the switch, moving it back and forth many many times until the mirror moved the tiniest amount. Then gradually got more and more movement. There’s a nice DIY on taking them apart and cleaning.
In regards to your roof, I thought it was interesting that you said the rear glass was replaced. Depending how long ago that was, it plays well into the theory that the roof had a tree/branch impact at some point. Of course maybe it’s just the rear defrost wasn’t working, and they replaced the glass. Makes no difference. The nice thing is you’re saving this car from the crusher. -Mike

[Mike W.]

There should be an allen wrench in your trunk tool kit to manually open and close the sunroof if neccesary. Not sure if that applies to 85’s but someone will correct me if not.

I think they're all the same, but it's a standard sized metric allen size, 3MM? Maybe? I've got a folding hex key set I've used, and it definitely applies to an '85. It's under that trapezoid plastic cover, roughly 1" X 3".

[joeuser999]

Ok, great.. I wasn't aware of the allen key option & will give that a try. (Sadly my OEM tool tray is empty)

My window breaker was in place but no function when pushed in.. Last night I pulled that dash skirt and the breaker.

The breaker I have is toast... looks like they are still available new from BMW. $72.22 (in 2024), part# 61311369375
Anyone know if there is an aftermarket as equal for less?

To test the harness I just dropped a 25a ATO fuse into the bare harness leads. Now getting power to the drivers window.. switch operation is little spotty, but working.. a refurb / contact clean of the window switches is probably next.

With the ATO fuse hotwire, only the driver window is working & I'll still need to pull center console to check the window switch harnesses for power..

Assuming that, with the ignition on, I should see +12v at the switch harness? does the window switch trip a relay, or is it wired directly to the motor? Answer if you like & I'll check the books in the mean time!

Thanks again!

[Galahad]

electrical diagrams are here: http://www.wedophones.com/BMWManualsLead.htm

[Mike W.]

The allen is in the center of a largish nut, which preloads the clutch. Its to to be tight enough to drive it, but not too tight. Loosening that nut may make it crank easier with the allen.

The window switches are wired in series so if one is out it won't work at all. Or if one is bad.

[joeuser999]

Ok.. I took a crack at opening the sunroof over the weekend.

Finding that the 4mm allen will only rotate about 1.25 turns & hitting what feels like a hard stop on either end. Not forcing it. The action I have lowers the rear of the sunroof into the roof panel & raises it back to the closed position..

The sunroof buttons also get me this far, so the switch and supply wiring seems good. Getting downward tilt, and back to closed state.. no upward tilt and no sliding back&forth.. long press of the buttons after reaching the described limits results in a high pitched whine coming from the motor. (No more long press until I figure out what is preventing motion)

I also read another post warning that the 4mm allen will raise/lower the sunroof panel, but will not operate the forward/backward sliding motion.. Can anyone else confirm? If that claim is true I guess once the rear of the panel is lowered I should push the panel back manually? And to manually slide the panel I guess i should also disengage that big 22mm clutch nut? Or do I need to completely pull the motor assembly?

Primary goal will be to clear the drip tray of any debris and make sure the drains are working. I'll replace the seals as soon as I'm able but really dont care about a sunroof per se... I care more about preventing further water ingress.

Other side notes.. driver side window still working well after swapping in the ATO fuse (in place of the window breaker). Other windows still do not operate & still need to disassemble the center console & refurb switches.

pulled the door seals to drop the sides of the head liner.. LOTS of bird seed, acorns & mouse shit in there.. amazingly the liner doesnt appear overly stained from the occupent's perspective.. will defintely be an ongoing source of odor tho... Not much room to clean without wrecking the liner entirely & finding that the door seal rubber is separating from the fuzzy fabric tuft strip that was likely glued on originally.. Bit of a pain getting everything tucked back in & adding new inner door seals to my long list.

I did use an ozone generator to cut some of the mildew/ratpiss odor.. seems to be improving still not "like new" & trying to heed warnings about ozone harming the leather.. I will reassess after it sits in the sun for a few more days.

Any and all advice is welcome and appreciated...Thanks!

[austin8753]

go get two or three gallons of distilled vinegar, open the top and leave them in the car for a few days. i've done this on particularly nasty cars with good results.

[Mike W.]

I also read another post warning that the 4mm allen will raise/lower the sunroof panel, but will not operate the forward/backward sliding motion.. Can anyone else confirm? If that claim is true I guess once the rear of the panel is lowered I should push the panel back manually? And to manually slide the panel I guess i should also disengage that big 22mm clutch nut? Or do I need to completely pull the motor assembly?

No, that allen should move it thru it's entire range of motion, not just up/down. But loosen that 22MM nut and then you will just be working the sunroof mechanism, not turning the motor also. I'm not sure removing the motor would really help any. You may need someone pushing on the panel while you're working the allen.

You're probably looking at eventually removing the sunroof panel and cables, cleaning and lubing everything and reassembling it. I did that on an E12 one time, same mech, that worked but barely, and when done it practically flew open and closed. It's possible something in there is broken, but more likely that it's just dirty with dried out grease.

[joeuser999]

It's possible something in there is broken, but more likely that it's just dirty with dried out grease.

Also suspecting a fair bit of bird seed, acorns & mouse droppings.

[joeuser999]

Hmm.. car was running fine on saturday morning & drove it all over town. I let it sit for an hour or so, now it will start but wont idle.. possible a new vacuum leak has sprung?...

Now recalling that yesterday I added some injector cleaner (12oz oriley brand) to a full tank of gas (91 non-oxy) .. cant hardly believe that's the source of a failure to idle..

Any other ideas why an otherwise running car would all of a sudden fail to idle unless feathering the throttle manually?

will be checking everything over this afternoon.. hoping it was just a momentary condition.

[Galahad]

When that's happened to me it's been airflow - I'd check vac leaks, AFM, idle valve

[joeuser999]

Found one seriousish air leak at the crank case vent hose (BMW 11151276485), thanks to this little smoke generator:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0BGB41DLK

Never again will I use the old (also read fruitless) air leak finding method of a propane bottle, or alcohol spray, or ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
Besides painstaking manual inspection of every square mm of the intake, I doubt I'd find the leak without this smoke generator.. well worth the $80!

replacement hose is on order.. I will RTV the hose I have for now and report back!

[joeuser999]

Ok, final update for the day..? -- What a difference!

Since we acquired in May & once I sorted the fuel pump situation, she would idle erratically & seemed like the computer (& also, I suspect, the Idle control valve) would search for a good idle setting, sometimes briefly surging and other times dropping as low as what seemed like 60rpm.. She'd chug around for a while & sometimes idle ok, or maybe sometimes die... Typically, once warmed up she'd run "a little" better.

Whatever caused her to stop idling completely the other day seems to have been solved by my RTV & hockey tape kludge. (genuine replacement hose on order)

Seriously, what a difference.. Now the idle is steady & stronger than ever! Fwiew!...?

Still no dash readings for rpm, speed, odo, temp, etc.. Fuel level sender has power & pegs at max value. I highly suspect SI board is out (& zero trouble shooting on that thus far).

Thanks again and in advance for any tips!!

[joeuser999]

Damn!

I took her out for a ~5 mile loop & she died on me waiting for a left turn on the final leg... Initially she wouldn't start, so I pushed her around the corner to assess. After 3-5 minutes offline, she would start up again... Luckily I was only about 6 blocks out & was able to limp her home by manually feathering the throttle up the hill to our house...Sheesh!

This was kinda the exact same symptom as the other day.. she just wouldn't idle.. runs for a few seconds & dies.. wait a few minutes & she'll start, then gotta feather the throttle manually. Rinse & repeat.

As stated, still no rpm/temp/oil/etc readings in the dash, so kind of flying blind.. Could be a mild overheat situation...?..advice on where to check?

It was a hot-ish day today (~80F?)...hotter than any other day I've run her on the road, & this was slow speed cursing on side streets, mostly in 3rd gear at ~30mph..

Valve cover & filler cap were VERY hot to the touch after she died.. No blisters to speak of & didn't have my laser temp scanner with me either, so zero helpful data.

Underside of the oil filler cap is wet with oil, so assuming oil pump is operating as it should.

I guess I'll re-check for proper fuel pressure again & I should keep checking for other vac leaks. I'll also test/clean the idle control valve for good measure.

I kinda got hopeful taking her out after patching this initial vac leak... Really bummed she isn't reliable atm & honestly feeling super lucky that she made it the 45 miles from the sellers house...

Any thoughts?

[joeuser999]

After limping home the other night I really had to scratch my head. Seemed like it just wouldn't idle steady at all & wanted to die. just like when I had the vacuum leak.. Rechecked with the smoke machine and the intake is air-tight. While idling, I checked battery voltage and saw only 12.4v, so the new alternator wasn't alternating.

I replaced my original alternator not because it didn't work, (it still does) It's just that the rubber bushings had turned into some kind of gelatinous slurry that had mostly flowed out, so no matter what i did the pulley was misaligned and barely any tension on the belt..

So I put in the new alt and everything was good for a few days, so wtf would it stop charging?

I attempted to pull the regulator & at the re-man factory they used external star head screws (WTF). I don't own any star head sockets & tried a pliers, then promptly gave up and pulled the entire alternator again(I'm an expert now!).

With the alternator out, I took it to oriley to test.. no dice, their machine is throwing some dongle error and wont run the test.. Then I go to Advance auto. their machine doesn't have this alternator in the database and also wont run the test. So I hit oriley on the other side of town & the re-manned alternator tests good. He ran the test twice. It's good.

Next ensued a 30hr deep dive on this & other forums for troubleshooting e28 alternators, which apparently never fail... And lo, there was the battery light in the instrument cluster.

When I did the key-on-don't-start check, I had no battery light. I know I've seen it before & i definitely had good charging prior to this (at least some of the time)

Nothing in my cluster works anyway, so i hadn't given it much thought.. At least some of the time when we first got the car, it was charging.. even after swapping in the new alternator, it was charging.. sometime between the swap and now, the light stopped working..

i pulled the cluster and the battery bulb cartridge is BADLY corroded.. So next I disassemble the whole cluster and find that my SI board is also BADLY corroded and the corrosion has also spread to the main cluster PCB & to the PCB on the speedo assembly. Oof.

The PCB contacts for the battery light were completely crusted over with green gunk. I used baking soda, water & a toothbrush to clean all the acid/grime I could from the surface of the main PCB, especially around the battery light socket and its traces back to the big blue connector. At least that part of the PCB traces are in tact and after re-assembly i have a strong/bright battery light at the key-on-no-start check.

I fire her up and she's purring now. I'm thinking with the alternator not alternating, the system voltage was so low that the fuel pump was under powered, and possibly the ignition as well.. Odd how more rev's would keep her running & after dying shed still turn over...maybe only for so long until the battery was totally dead?

Anyway now the idle is very strong now and seeing 13.7-14.1v at the battery. Fixed!

Adding SI board replacement to the list & fingers crossed I don't need a new speedo assembly as well!

[stuartinmn]

I replaced my original alternator not because it didn't work, (it still does) It's just that the rubber bushings had turned into some kind of gelatinous slurry that had mostly flowed out, so no matter what i did the pulley was misaligned and barely any tension on the belt..

There are replacement bushings available that are made out of a harder, more durable material (it may be urethane, I'm not sure). It's been years since I replaced mine but they were pretty inexpensive. So, if your original alternator otherwise still works it would be a good idea to get the bushings and then you'll have a good spare. A number of places sell them, just google on 'e28 alternator bushings'.

[topher800]

Regarding mouse nests, et al:

Nature’s Miracle. Works just as good on mouse stuff as it does on dog and cat stuff. It’s a natural enzyme that eats that stuff away. You can get a spray bottle at the local pet store.