New Alternative to Factory Heater Valve

[LarryM]

I saw these advertised on Facebook. Looks promising, price is reasonable and looks better than kluging an E46 heater valve onto an E28 firewall. Has anybody actually purchased one and tried it out?

https://klimakit.com/product/bvx5/?fbcl ... V_gHp5tN7R

[Shawn D.]

I saw that as well. I'm interested to see folks' long-term reports!

[Philo]

Pretty cool but pricey. Aren't there options from other models ?

[Mike W.]

Pretty cool but pricey. Aren't there options from other models ?

Yeah, that thought crossed my mind. If it was for a Ford pickup truck it would probably be $29.95. But it isn't and the factory one, which people have been having lots of problems with, is around $400. So in that light it's not that expensive. Probably 5K in development and it now costs ten bucks to make if they make enough of them. But just how much demand is there for 80s BMW heater valves?

[Federico]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems to me the body is a 3d printed piece.
It would be interesting to know which process and material was used.

[LarryM]

A guy on the E28 Facebook page bought one and seems to like it a lot. Says it’s a perfect fit and functions fine. I wonder about the longevity. But I’m hoping for the best.

Shame on BMW for foisting those crappy Chinese-made heater valves on us; I’ve gone through three of them in as many years. They only warranty it once; if you have to replace a new one that failed within 12 months, that replacement won’t be covered when IT fails. They don’t seem to care about correcting what is obviously a quality control issue.

[MisterFixit]

Hey, just a thought that has occurred to the 'Inventor' in me.
How many have tried a simpler 'hardware store' solution to this issue?

I am about to go down to my local Ace Hardware or Home Despot and try something with my three favorite adjectives: Simpler, Cheaper, and Reliable.

I will post my results when I have something to report...

Andy

[1st 5er]

Hey, just a thought that has occurred to the 'Inventor' in me.
How many have tried a simpler 'hardware store' solution to this issue?

I am about to go down to my local Ace Hardware or Home Despot and try something with my three favorite adjectives: Simpler, Cheaper, and Reliable.

I will post my results when I have something to report...

Andy

Looking forward to this "cheaper" solution.

[stuartinmn]

If a person wanted to go with something really basic, 1960s Ford pickups (and probably many other vehicles) used a manual valve that was operated with a cable, so water flow to the heater core was basically on or off. They sell for around $30.

[Mike W.]

Hey, just a thought that has occurred to the 'Inventor' in me.
How many have tried a simpler 'hardware store' solution to this issue?

I am about to go down to my local Ace Hardware or Home Despot and try something with my three favorite adjectives: Simpler, Cheaper, and Reliable.

I will post my results when I have something to report...

Andy

I was ready to dismiss your suggestion out of hand, thinking a mechanical valve, no problem. An electric valve, well that's another story. So I searched for a 12V water valve and up come some things, not that expensive. Plastic ones really cheap, but I don't think those would work for long, but even brass ones aren't that expensive, like 1/2" for twenty bucks. Or a Viton one for $30. However, duty cycle may be a problem. And solenoids have a big inrush on current, but little on hold, but if it cycles a lot that could generate a lot of heat. They even say max 8 hours duty cycle though I don't know if that's continuous or what. They all seem to be normally closed so a relay to reverse polarity would be required, and maybe even only use the factory power to switch the relay rather than risk burning out the driver for it. So again, depending on duty cycle, it might only last 3 days. But nothing ventured nothing gained.

Of course you could use a plain mechanical valve as came on late E21s and either set up a Bowden cable or just manually actuate it by season, but the latter is kind of declass for a BMW.

[MisterFixit]

Hey, just a thought that has occurred to the 'Inventor' in me.
How many have tried a simpler 'hardware store' solution to this issue?

I am about to go down to my local Ace Hardware or Home Despot and try something with my three favorite adjectives: Simpler, Cheaper, and Reliable.

I will post my results when I have something to report...

Andy

Looking forward to this "cheaper" solution.

First report- parts in hand, total cost $21.89... CHEAPER

[MisterFixit]

If a person wanted to go with something really basic, 1960s Ford pickups (and probably many other vehicles) used a manual valve that was operated with a cable, so water flow to the heater core was basically on or off. They sell for around $30.

We are on the same wavelength, Stuart. I was thinking of my 2002 cable operated valve.

[MisterFixit]

Hey, just a thought that has occurred to the 'Inventor' in me.
...
Andy

I was ready to dismiss your suggestion out of hand, thinking a mechanical valve, no problem. An electric valve, well that's another story. So I searched for a 12V water valve and up come some things, not that expensive. Plastic ones really cheap, but I don't think those would work for long, but even brass ones aren't that expensive, like 1/2" for twenty bucks. Or a Viton one for $30. However, duty cycle may be a problem. And solenoids have a big inrush on current, but little on hold, but if it cycles a lot that could generate a lot of heat. They even say max 8 hours duty cycle though I don't know if that's continuous or what. They all seem to be normally closed so a relay to reverse polarity would be required, and maybe even only use the factory power to switch the relay rather than risk burning out the driver for it. So again, depending on duty cycle, it might only last 3 days. But nothing ventured nothing gained.

Of course you could use a plain mechanical valve as came on late E21s and either set up a Bowden cable or just manually actuate it by season, but the latter is kind of declass for a BMW.

Yeah, the BMW operating model is kind of 'jittery' with lots of cycling. Anything designed for 'occasional' on/off is not likely to survive. I am using the mechanical solution, and since I adjusted my hood latch mechanism to actually OPEN THE HOOD with a tug, which it wasn't before, the 'per season' adjustment will work for me. Hell, I do check my oil more often, so no hay problema!

The last time the hood was removed/replaced for major engine work, it was misaligned and WOW, what a PIA it was to open and close! AFTER I finally got it open, I did some backyard bodywork, adjusting and bending things until it worked properly. THANK YOU, MyE28 Tech FAQ, for the instructions on how to open a cranky hood. (We Rock!)

[MisterFixit]

UPDATE-
I pulled a used valve from a parts yard yesterday -- not very often you find an '86 E28 in the yard!
My intent was to find the exact diameter of the input and output fittings; no manufacturers of replacement valves will tell you this, just how to buy one of their valves!

I measured them to be 0.7804 inches (+/-), so I plan to try a 3/4 inch hose barb fitting.

[Mike W.]

I'm still not sure about duty ratings, but if one could find a budget steam rated valve it might work well, steam is hot, really hot, so even the coil for the steam rated valve might be rated at enough heat to take a higher duty cycle. Might not, but might.

[K-jetFTW]

I've been running a Four Seasons 74678 ball valve since 2019. Similar to Stuart above pic. It's fine.

I never cared enough, but I'm sure there's a universal carb cable kit that can be modified to work from inside. Lawn mower throttle cable maybe.

[MisterFixit]

Refreshing, but not surprising, to see so many ideas popping up!

[DavidE9]

If any of you really need one, I have a spare I can send you. The housing isn't in good shape and probably can't be saved but the value inside still responds to voltage. Yours for free if you really need one and aren't just taking it because its free.

[Ohmess]

Obviously a different type of valve, but perhaps the process The Hack Mechanic used for the e9 might be helpful:

https://e9coupe.com/forum/threads/diy-h ... ost-128141

[Mike W.]

Didn't read the full E9 link, but I wonder if how a vacuum actuated valve would hold up. I believe vacuum switching valves are inexpensive so one might be able to use a vacuum switching valve to control vacuum to the valve much like the original design. I don't know again about duty cycle, just how many hundred or thousands of cycles they are capable of, but it might be worth investigating. I know lots of cars, including on BMW at least E23s used a vacuum water valve.

[four2zerohero]

for my e23, I have contemplated using a Mercedes heater valve out of a w201, they are vacuum operated and cost 17 bucks, better than replacing or rebuilding the behr one, Mounting wont be as nice as the original, but a possible solution.

[MisterFixit]

OK, parts in hand, getting ready to install. I'd post a picture of my workaround, but it seems my cable for this is AWOL.

No, I do not own a smartphone, and the camera is not 'wireless.' It is digital, but needs an umbilical to download images. I'll keep looking... Help me, Saint Anthony.

[Mike W.]

OK, parts in hand, getting ready to install. I'd post a picture of my workaround, but it seems my cable for this is AWOL.

No, I do not own a smartphone, and the camera is not 'wireless.' It is digital, but needs an umbilical to download images. I'll keep looking... Help me, Saint Anthony.

And I thought I was behind the curve on smartphones.

Really, if you don't want to go that route it might still be worth it to get one, not to use as a phone, but for pics. Then you could just email them to yourself if you have WIFI. Without phone service. Used phones are so cheap if you get an old one and some have pretty decent cameras even if the manufacturers try to obsolete them in various ways. Might want to think about it.

[K-jetFTW]

For a BMW-correct solution, one could convert to E28 manual water valve 64211368650.

You would use manual temp dial 64111373938 with bowden cable 64111367698, or use another similar cable from the yard.

Guessing this would not only be more reliable, but also still cheaper than the $400 new water valve. Better appearance. Loads of 518's probably came this way overseas.

Wondering if anybody done this ? Maybe a Euro member ?

[Mike W.]

That looks very similar to a US market late E21 valve. I've even got one or two of them in my box of water parts.

[1st 5er]

[MisterFixit]

Hey Sherman! I knew you'd take an interest in this...

[davintosh]

Me too!

Just this week I noticed a little weepage around the heater valve in my car. If it ain’t one thing…

[MisterFixit]

Solved! Now if the forum will take new posts, I will explain.

[MisterFixit]

Mission Accomplished! Here are the particulars... and THANKS BE TO FORUM ADMINS for fixing this wonderful forum.

Approach- Bypass the broken "automatic temperature control" electric heater valve with a manual valve.

Parts- SAE (inch) dimensions
1- 3/4 male hose barb x 3/4 Male Iron Pipe (MIP), straight adapter
1- 3/4 male hose barb x 3/4 MIP, 90 degree adapter
1- Brass 1/4 turn valve, 3/4 FIP, stainless steel ball, unrestricted, handle- flat, 3/4 x 4 inches
(the valve I used closes by turning the handle clockwise 90 degrees with the handle facing you)
Teflon tape for threaded connections
2- new hose clamps

Installation-
With new valve OPEN, handle up, install 90 degree fitting on top and straight fitting on bottom using teflon tape.
DO NOT OVERTIGHTENl The system only holds 15 or so psia.
Drain some coolant from catch tank.
Remove 2 mounting screws (7mm) holding heater valve to bracket on firewall.
Loosen top hose clamp, rock valve to loosen/remove, replace hose clamp, and install 90 deg. fitting in hose.
Tighten hose clamp.
Loosen lower hose clamp, rock valve to loosen, replace hose clamp, and install new valve straight fitting in hose.
Tighten hose clamp.
Adjust valve so handle is accessible and moves freely with no interference from brake hard lines.
(In my car, handle is "up" parallel to valve when open, & swings down towards the front left wheel to close.
From above, the handle points "Northwest" when closed, with "North" straight ahead.)
Double check hose clamps are tight.
Top off coolant, open valve, run engine to purge air, and warm up to operating temperature.
Test by running heater fan: open defroster, then close and open foot-well.
Test drive the new valve, be sure it blows HOT AIR!
Re-check coolant level, top off as needed.
Note- check coolant for protection level, or flush and refill with new is a good idea... winter is coming

Operation-
Handle vertical to open valve, horizontal to close, intermediate position as desired for 'throttling' to adjust cabin temperature. This is a simple procedure, but you must open the hood to do it. You may want to clean off all the surfaces and pipes in the vicinity. This avoids getting greasy when adjusting the valve.

Concerns-
metallurgical compatibility with engine and coolant

I am ready tor your comments and suggestions. I KNOW you want pictures; I am still looking for the cable to down- load them from my old digital camera (it's NOT a smartphone).

It's a manual solution, not nearly as elegant as the 'fingertip' adjustment of a temperature wheel, BUT it was under $30 total, took half an hour, and should last for the life of the car (or the driver) - whichever comes first.

Simple, inexpensive, and effective, my favorite combination (next to a mint julep).