Here you go. These sites contain some radical units. Definately high flowing for high RPM engines.
http://www.bmw535bitic.com/
http://www.m535t.com/
Courtesy of BF again
RussC
[Edit by russc on [TIME]1140943366[/TIME]]
Looking for ideas on custom E28(M30) intakes....
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Aaron from Aus
- Posts: 559
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
- Location: Australia
- Contact:
Seen that first one a while back...Soo bloody neat....you would not know it even had a Turbo.. That is what i will be doiing...i have a Alpina MAnifold with the intake on the other side...should work a treat!
That second one is just pure beast....not to worried about looks there...just whack it on and GO GO GO
That second one is just pure beast....not to worried about looks there...just whack it on and GO GO GO
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Andy335Touring
- Posts: 41
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
- Location: UK, Nottingham
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Andy335Touring
- Posts: 41
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
- Location: UK, Nottingham
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Damon in STL
- Posts: 474
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
- Location: St. Louis
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Andy335Touring
- Posts: 41
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
- Location: UK, Nottingham
http://bmwturbos.scottiesharpe.com/topi ... IC_ID=3310
This is the Miller Intake manifold
[Edit by 345is on [TIME]1141183501[/TIME]]
This is the Miller Intake manifold
[Edit by 345is on [TIME]1141183501[/TIME]]
[QUOTE="Tjn182"]Someone explain to me why 12 injectors is better than 6? I'm pretty sure there is no gain by installing more injectors... why not just bump the 6 you already have to 72#ers? You're still adding a crap load more fuel.[/QUOTE]
For FI, 12 are a much better deal. You have to have an advanced ECU such as the TEC3 to run them though. Getting an engine to run well at idle thru WOT with monster 71 lb injectors is problematic, ask me why I know. The large injectors produce too much fuel at idle and low RPM. With duel stage injectors, you can run 30-40 lb injectors primary and have the second injectors deliver fuel at a specified boost rate and above. Makes for a very nice running FI engine.
I am asking Dan about producing a M30B35 manifold with the additional 6 injectors for my application. I may just send him mine.
For FI, 12 are a much better deal. You have to have an advanced ECU such as the TEC3 to run them though. Getting an engine to run well at idle thru WOT with monster 71 lb injectors is problematic, ask me why I know. The large injectors produce too much fuel at idle and low RPM. With duel stage injectors, you can run 30-40 lb injectors primary and have the second injectors deliver fuel at a specified boost rate and above. Makes for a very nice running FI engine.
I am asking Dan about producing a M30B35 manifold with the additional 6 injectors for my application. I may just send him mine.
[QUOTE="Duke M535ti Backup"]For FI, 12 are a much better deal. You have to have an advanced ECU such as the TEC3 to run them though. Getting an engine to run well at idle thru WOT with monster 71 lb injectors is problematic, ask me why I know. The large injectors produce too much fuel at idle and low RPM. With duel stage injectors, you can run 30-40 lb injectors primary and have the second injectors deliver fuel at a specified boost rate and above. Makes for a very nice running FI engine.
I am asking Dan about producing a M30B35 manifold with the additional 6 injectors for my application. I may just send him mine.[/QUOTE]
Duke,
With all do respect, 12 injectors is totally uneccesary and rather ridiculous. My car idles perfectly with the exact same injectors that you have. Your tuning is crap.
With today's technology, additional injectors are a thing of the past when engine ecus could not be modified to run large injectors or affordable standalones were expensive or unavailable.
The only benefit to that setup is the bling factor. Complete waste of money IMHO for you application. Maybe it has some value for a 745i car but it isn't a route I would ever take.
Todd
[Edit by T_C_D on [TIME]1141221220[/TIME]]
I am asking Dan about producing a M30B35 manifold with the additional 6 injectors for my application. I may just send him mine.[/QUOTE]
Duke,
With all do respect, 12 injectors is totally uneccesary and rather ridiculous. My car idles perfectly with the exact same injectors that you have. Your tuning is crap.
With today's technology, additional injectors are a thing of the past when engine ecus could not be modified to run large injectors or affordable standalones were expensive or unavailable.
The only benefit to that setup is the bling factor. Complete waste of money IMHO for you application. Maybe it has some value for a 745i car but it isn't a route I would ever take.
Todd
[Edit by T_C_D on [TIME]1141221220[/TIME]]
[QUOTE="T_C_D"]Your tuning is crap. [/QUOTE]
Yes it is. That something that will need to be addressed when you guys have the car. If we can not get rid of the running rich a idle/low RPM. Additional injectors will be needed.
Who are you guys going to use for the TEC3 tuning? I will also need a bigger fuel pump, still have the stock one.
[Edit by Duke M535ti Backup on [TIME]1141223598[/TIME]]
Yes it is. That something that will need to be addressed when you guys have the car. If we can not get rid of the running rich a idle/low RPM. Additional injectors will be needed.
Who are you guys going to use for the TEC3 tuning? I will also need a bigger fuel pump, still have the stock one.
[Edit by Duke M535ti Backup on [TIME]1141223598[/TIME]]
[QUOTE="T_C_D"]Your tuning is crap. [/QUOTE]
[QUOTE="Duke M535ti Backup"]Yes it is. That something that will need to be addressed when you guys have the car. If we can not get rid of the running rich a idle/low RPM. Additional injectors will be needed.
Who are you guys going to use for the TEC3 tuning? I will also need a bigger fuel pump, still have the stock one.
[Edit by Duke M535ti Backup on [TIME]1141223598[/TIME]][/QUOTE]
We'll go with smaller injectors if necessary but I doubt that is the case. I will be doing the tuning.
Todd
[Edit by T_C_D on [TIME]1141224871[/TIME]]
[QUOTE="Duke M535ti Backup"]Yes it is. That something that will need to be addressed when you guys have the car. If we can not get rid of the running rich a idle/low RPM. Additional injectors will be needed.
Who are you guys going to use for the TEC3 tuning? I will also need a bigger fuel pump, still have the stock one.
[Edit by Duke M535ti Backup on [TIME]1141223598[/TIME]][/QUOTE]
We'll go with smaller injectors if necessary but I doubt that is the case. I will be doing the tuning.
Todd
[Edit by T_C_D on [TIME]1141224871[/TIME]]
Ok,
Using large injs is just a matter of tuning. Duke, if your system is runing rich, its not tuned properly. There is no way 71lb injs are TOO big. They use 80-90lb injs on WRXs and there 2.5l!!!! With that said, there is a limit of what size inj you can use for a given displacement, but I don't know what it is. The actuall way would be a CFM/lb-min of fuel ie a maximum of fuel inj per CFM. There is a point that the inj duty cycle can't go lower per a given CFM if the injs are too large. I read this somewhere, and I'll see if I can find it again. But Im sure your not at that limit yet.
Now, Millers manifold. I agree with Todd, that is way overkill both in terms of IC'ing and fuel delivery. That is over the top. The cost to implement that is over a $1k. You can do the same thing by using a proper water inj system or upgraded IC in the first place. And both of those solution are way cheaper than adding 6 inj's to a custom manifod :~
The standard IC on the M106 is woefully inadaquet for more than 8-9psi. Thats the first thing Id do if I was going to run 10+psi in a M106.
On the other side. I guess if your trying to run 600hp, that can work, but Id almost never put that system on my car. It is a nice engineering exercise.
Also, in Dans 745i.com description of this product, he says that FMU aren't totally repeatable, but doesn't say why. The reason is that FMUs add fuel based on boost, not actuall air mass. You can have 10psi of boost, but the air mass will change with temp(PV=nRT). The FMU has no way to compensate for that. So, if your in Az in the summer, the system will run rich(which isn't such a bad thing) due to higher temps. In Alaska, in the winter the system will run lean~0 Lesson over.
RussC
Using large injs is just a matter of tuning. Duke, if your system is runing rich, its not tuned properly. There is no way 71lb injs are TOO big. They use 80-90lb injs on WRXs and there 2.5l!!!! With that said, there is a limit of what size inj you can use for a given displacement, but I don't know what it is. The actuall way would be a CFM/lb-min of fuel ie a maximum of fuel inj per CFM. There is a point that the inj duty cycle can't go lower per a given CFM if the injs are too large. I read this somewhere, and I'll see if I can find it again. But Im sure your not at that limit yet.
Now, Millers manifold. I agree with Todd, that is way overkill both in terms of IC'ing and fuel delivery. That is over the top. The cost to implement that is over a $1k. You can do the same thing by using a proper water inj system or upgraded IC in the first place. And both of those solution are way cheaper than adding 6 inj's to a custom manifod :~
The standard IC on the M106 is woefully inadaquet for more than 8-9psi. Thats the first thing Id do if I was going to run 10+psi in a M106.
On the other side. I guess if your trying to run 600hp, that can work, but Id almost never put that system on my car. It is a nice engineering exercise.
Also, in Dans 745i.com description of this product, he says that FMU aren't totally repeatable, but doesn't say why. The reason is that FMUs add fuel based on boost, not actuall air mass. You can have 10psi of boost, but the air mass will change with temp(PV=nRT). The FMU has no way to compensate for that. So, if your in Az in the summer, the system will run rich(which isn't such a bad thing) due to higher temps. In Alaska, in the winter the system will run lean~0 Lesson over.
RussC
i bet theres at least onespot between the Az and Ak where you can pull over and adjust the FMU. 
[QUOTE="russc"]The FMU has no way to compensate for that. So, if your in Az in the summer, the system will run rich(which isn't such a bad thing) due to higher temps. In Alaska, in the winter the system will run lean~0 Lesson over.
RussC[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE="russc"]The FMU has no way to compensate for that. So, if your in Az in the summer, the system will run rich(which isn't such a bad thing) due to higher temps. In Alaska, in the winter the system will run lean~0 Lesson over.
RussC[/QUOTE]