This'll leave a mark...

Boru · Post by **Boru** » Mar 14, 2006 5:35 PM

dcbrewmeister · Post by **dcbrewmeister** » Mar 14, 2006 5:40 PM

Did you leave the drill on and go to lunch?

Velocewest · Post by **Velocewest** » Mar 14, 2006 5:42 PM

Drilling your piston squirters? Did you get the angles from someone? I can check them for you this weekend, my block is basically stripped and ready to go to the machine shop.

DMNaskale · Post by **DMNaskale** » Mar 14, 2006 5:52 PM

He is probably going to be happier not knowing if he has the wrong angles at this point.

Post by **Shawn D.** » Mar 14, 2006 5:54 PM

Velocewest wrote:Drilling your piston squirters? Did you get the angles from someone? I can check them for you this weekend, my block is basically stripped and ready to go to the machine shop.

I'm planning to install some myself -- I'd sure appreciate having that data -- TIA!

Boru · Post by **Boru** » Mar 14, 2006 6:00 PM

I figured I'd just install the engine upside down anyway so the bores and backs of the pistons fill with oil

I aimed the squirters at the center of the wrist pin when at TDC... 20 degrees from vertical. I feel there will be sufficient coverage that way.
<img src=http://groups.msn.com/_Secure/0RgDdAuUT ... 4506138562>

dcbrewmeister · Post by **dcbrewmeister** » Mar 14, 2006 6:19 PM

Question - How are you going to get all 6 cyl?

DMNaskale · Post by **DMNaskale** » Mar 14, 2006 6:24 PM

My previous smartass post aside, I've often wondered how much engineering and how much "lets just point 'em up the bore" there was back when BMW first put them in. Spraying a constant stream up there at a fast moving target probably results in a goodly spattering of oil all over the piston. As long as it doesn't get too much on the bore I would think the exact angle isn't critical. But then I'm not a German engineer.

Boru · Post by **Boru** » Mar 14, 2006 6:26 PM

dcbrewmeister wrote:Question - How are you going to get all 6 cyl?

First I have to get 5 more drills since I left the first one in the hole.
Seven main bearing seats, I drilled/counter bored 6.
BTW, the drill that I left there so that I could go to lunch... it's held in place by the Bridgeport which the block is sitting upon.

dcbrewmeister · Post by **dcbrewmeister** » Mar 14, 2006 6:31 PM

DOH - looking at 4cyl crank oops

shifty · Post by **shifty** » Mar 14, 2006 6:31 PM

Sweeney wrote:BTW, the drill that I left there so that I could go to lunch... it's held in place by the Bridgeport which the block is sitting upon.

Did he really think you hand-drilled that hole?!!

Boru · Post by **Boru** » Mar 14, 2006 6:40 PM

I, of course, contemplated the angle. At first i thought to aim them at the center of the wristpin when at half stroke but assumed that, at TDC, the spray would hit the far side of the bore.... but then, it may not... it would nicely hose down the rod... hmmmm. Then, I thought, what does the spray pattern look like... the angle of the cone, etc. I stuck one of the nozzles in a short length of 1/4" fuel line and filled the line with 15-40 oil I had warmed to about 150F. I adjusted my compressor to 45psi, placed the blowgun in the other end of the fuel line and sprayed the oil onto a piece of cardboard from 5 inches (roughly the distance from the installed nozzle to the centerline of the wristpin). This produced a circular pattern of about 2" Dia.... nice for covering the bottom of the piston while at TDC.

DMNaskale · Post by **DMNaskale** » Mar 14, 2006 7:21 PM

I stuck one of the nozzles in a short length of 1/4" fuel line and filled the line with 15-40 oil I had warmed to about 150F. I adjusted my compressor to 45psi, placed the blowgun in the other end of the fuel line and sprayed the oil onto a piece of cardboard from 5 inches (roughly the distance from the installed nozzle to the centerline of the wristpin). This produced a circular pattern of about 2" Dia.... nice for covering the bottom of the piston while at TDC.

Now that is the kind of quality information I come here for.

Velocewest · Post by **Velocewest** » Mar 14, 2006 8:19 PM

Sweeney wrote:I figured I'd just install the engine upside down anyway so the bores and backs of the pistons fill with oil

That's the best idea I've heard this week. That should take care of any problems with cam oiling too.

The M106 block is drilled a little off center, maybe to aim around the rod at TDC? Still I think your positioning will work fine. I just stuck a dowel in the hole to see where the nozzle was aimed, like you say it appears the goal is a good pattern at TDC.

Boru · Post by **Boru** » Mar 14, 2006 9:11 PM

Yeah, I don't think that it's terribly critical with everthing whipping around in there.

Post by **Shawn D.** » Mar 14, 2006 9:47 PM

John,

I think my Taig is a bit too small to hold my block like you're doing on your Bridgeport.

I was considering making a drill jig to do the job, indexing it off the main cap bolt holes. Do you think that'll work OK?

What drills, mills, and/or reamers did you use to make the holes?

Thanks,
Shawn

Boru · Post by **Boru** » Mar 15, 2006 6:10 AM

Hey Shawn,
I was thnking about a jig also in case anyone (without a Bridgeport or the like) wanted to do this. I would do as you mentioned, utilize the bearing cap mounts. An aluminum block with steel guides, solid steel or a steel construction would work.
I used a 3/8 end mill (because I dropped and damaged my last 5/16 mill) for the counter bore, spot drilled the center and then through bored with a 6mm drill. With a jig, I'd drill then use a piloted counter bore or a combo drill/counterbore.
The nozzles drop right in with the flange just below the level of the bearing seat. I plan to use GM gasket maker to hold them (though they are trapped by the bearing) and seal around them.

dcbrewmeister · Post by **dcbrewmeister** » Mar 15, 2006 10:57 AM

Shifty #2 wrote:
Sweeney wrote:BTW, the drill that I left there so that I could go to lunch... it's held in place by the Bridgeport which the block is sitting upon.
Did he really think you hand-drilled that hole?!!

Did who think???

russc · Post by **russc** » Mar 15, 2006 1:32 PM

DMNaskale wrote:
I stuck one of the nozzles in a short length of 1/4" fuel line and filled the line with 15-40 oil I had warmed to about 150F. I adjusted my compressor to 45psi, placed the blowgun in the other end of the fuel line and sprayed the oil onto a piece of cardboard from 5 inches (roughly the distance from the installed nozzle to the centerline of the wristpin). This produced a circular pattern of about 2" Dia.... nice for covering the bottom of the piston while at TDC.
Now that is the kind of quality information I come here for.

Me 2. Nice job Sweeney.

RussC

louielouie · Post by **louielouie** » Mar 15, 2006 1:36 PM

How will this affect overall oil pressure having 6 more points of pressure loss? I'm thinking oil pressure at low rpm's will be noticably lower...

Boru · Post by **Boru** » Mar 15, 2006 1:48 PM

louielouie wrote:How will this affect overall oil pressure having 6 more points of pressure loss? I'm thinking oil pressure at low rpm's will be noticably lower...

Yer thinkin' wrong, mister........

These nozzles have ball check valves built in. If I recall, the cracking pressure is 40ish psi. They won't spray until sufficient pressure is present.

tacm · Post by **tacm** » Mar 15, 2006 6:58 PM

Forgive me for being a Dumb ass.......but this mod is new to me. Can someone please tell me more about it? I know why you MAY want more oil on the wrist pin OR on the bottom of the piston to cool it (I think the do this in some AP applications)....but why our cars?

DMNaskale · Post by **DMNaskale** » Mar 15, 2006 7:25 PM

It's a turbo thing. The M106 engines (745i) came with the squirters stock to cool the pistons. No use otherwise. The M106 block is virtually identical to the M30 except for the squirters and an oil return fitting installed for the turbo oil supply.

Boru · Post by **Boru** » Mar 15, 2006 7:53 PM

Not just turbo engines have them, for instance, E46 M3 as well as others.
Yes, for cooling pistons and also for improving oil volume delivered to the oil rings and wrist pins. Without the nozzles there is only random splash oiling primarily from oil coming of the rod bearings. Some engines actually have notches in the sides of the rods at the bearing seat to allow more oil to be flung upwards towards the piston.

DMNaskale · Post by **DMNaskale** » Mar 15, 2006 8:51 PM

I stand corrected, I should have said it is a high output thing. But it is not a mod that would be worth doing to a M30 engine other than a forced induction or extremely modified application.

Boru · Post by **Boru** » Mar 15, 2006 9:31 PM

Or if you just felt like boring holes in a perfectly good block

tacm · Post by **tacm** » Mar 16, 2006 5:50 PM

Thanx.......steve

MyE28.com

MyE28.com

This'll leave a mark...

This'll leave a mark...