Introduce myself and questions to Upgrade Alpina B10 TT

[BerlinThunder]

Hello,

While surfing throught the net i just found this interesting site. I´ve never seen so many people talking about boosting the old M30.
About me :

I´m Alex and i´m from Berlin / Germany and my ride is an 93 Alpina B10 Biturbo. It runs 14,5 psi ( stock: 11,6)and in overboost it tops 17,4 shortly.

So I would like to use this opportunity to ask you guys some questions:
Due to cracked turbine housing i took off the engine out of my old B10 Bitubro and realized that both charger and the head gasket were worn out.
Alpina charges 1900 EURO per T25 and besides that they´re made in the early 90´s especialy for Alpina.So no chance to get them at Garrett.
What do you guys recommend to upgrade while replacing all the stuff? Head studs ? Is there anything what should be done to the head to make it ruggedized ( found that word in the dictionary ) for more boost ?

I got a software update and new injectors in 2006 and have now 10k on them. No problem so far except the turbine housing.
I can post dynos before and after if someone is interested.

Thanks in advance

Alex

[Duke]

Welcome....

First question for you - how do you afford to drive your B10 with the fuel prices in Germany? I have a friend who lives near Frankfurt and it costs him over $100 to fill up his M535i.

[BerlinThunder]

Welcome....

First question for you - how do you afford to drive your B10 with the fuel prices in Germany? I have a friend who lives near Frankfurt and it costs him over $100 to fill up his M535i.

My daily driver is VW Passat TDI and so no problems so far
The old lady has a 110l tank and it cost 150 euros ( should be around 200$ at the moment ) if it was really empty but it´s like a hobby to me. I´m not using it to drive every day. So the fuel isn´t a big problem.

Cheers Alex

[Kyle in NO]

If you are pulling the head I would suggest going with ARP headstuds and an Multi Layer Steel head gasket.

[DMNaskale]

Hello,

While surfing throught the net i just found this interesting site. I´ve never seen so many people talking about boosting the old M30.
About me :

I´m Alex and i´m from Berlin / Germany and my ride is an 93 Alpina B10 Biturbo. It runs 14,5 psi ( stock: 11,6)and in overboost it tops 17,4 shortly.

So I would like to use this opportunity to ask you guys some questions:
Due to cracked turbine housing i took off the engine out of my old B10 Bitubro and realized that both charger and the head gasket were worn out.
Alpina charges 1900 EURO per T25 and besides that they´re made in the early 90´s especialy for Alpina.So no chance to get them at Garrett.
What do you guys recommend to upgrade while replacing all the stuff? Head studs ? Is there anything what should be done to the head to make it ruggedized ( found that word in the dictionary ) for more boost ?

I got a software update and new injectors in 2006 and have now 10k on them. No problem so far except the turbine housing.
I can post dynos before and after if someone is interested.

Thanks in advance

Alex

The Garrett GT25R turbo is available over here new for under $1000 US each, and the turbine side is a match for your T25, they will bolt up to your manifolds and exhaust just fine and have the same .64 A/R. The compressor side housing is different, maybe your stock housings would work or you could adapt the plumbing. They are ball bearing units and would be a nice upgrade. The GT28R is the same price and turbine, with a bigger compressor if you wanted more of an upgrade for power potential.

[BerlinThunder]

If you are pulling the head I would suggest going with ARP headstuds and an Multi Layer Steel head gasket.

I was thinking of using ARP/Raceware Headstuds but haven´t decided yet. Which one is the best / better ? The headgasket thing seems a bit tricky. Alpina doesn´t give any info how thick the oem part is. So all i can do is measuring the old one. But i know that it has been compressed, so it´s now thinner than a new one. What do you recommend? i assume that .070 is stock, right ? Btw is there an online shop in the net which has all the M30 related parts ?

The Garrett GT25R turbo is available over here new for under $1000 US each, and the turbine side is a match for your T25, they will bolt up to your manifolds and exhaust just fine and have the same .64 A/R. The compressor side housing is different, maybe your stock housings would work or you could adapt the plumbing. They are ball bearing units and would be a nice upgrade. The GT28R is the same price and turbine, with a bigger compressor if you wanted more of an upgrade for power potential.

A GT25R seems the right one for my needs. But there are GT2554R & GT2560R.... What would you choose? The stock one had inducer 39mm / exducer 51mm (compressor)...Now 42mm /54mm isn´t that bigger and 46mm/ 60mm seems to be a big step if you bear in mind that you´ve to double it (TwinT !).....
As you can see i´m a bit unsure and i´d like to hear as many opinions as i can ...

thx again.

Cheers Alex

[Rich in Tupelo]

Got any pics of the BiTurbo you can share?

[T_C_D]

Hey Alex,

Shoot me an email. I can help you choose the proper turbos, headgasket and anything else you need.

Thanks,
Todd

[BerlinThunder]

Got any pics of the BiTurbo you can share?

It won´t work with the pic. Can someone help ?

Alex

ps.

Todd i sent you a pm.

[DMNaskale]

The Garrett GT25R turbo is available over here new for under $1000 US each, and the turbine side is a match for your T25, they will bolt up to your manifolds and exhaust just fine and have the same .64 A/R. The compressor side housing is different, maybe your stock housings would work or you could adapt the plumbing. They are ball bearing units and would be a nice upgrade. The GT28R is the same price and turbine, with a bigger compressor if you wanted more of an upgrade for power potential.

A GT25R seems the right one for my needs. But there are GT2554R & GT2560R.... What would you choose? The stock one had inducer 39mm / exducer 51mm (compressor)...Now 42mm /54mm isn´t that bigger and 46mm/ 60mm seems to be a big step if you bear in mind that you´ve to double it (TwinT !).....
As you can see i´m a bit unsure and i´d like to hear as many opinions as i can ...

thx again.

Cheers Alex

I debated this question at length myself and will not know if I made the right choice until I get my car put together. They have changed the way they name the turbos, the GT2560R is what they used to call the GT28R. I have a pair of GT28Rs and the exhaust manifolds from a B10 BT. But I am planning for higher boost and more power than the B10 BT. If you want to keep the engine close to original just use the GT2554Rs, they are already an upgrade to the stock T25s and should be more responsive and provide better power potential. And they will be a more direct swap into a stock B10 BT. If you want a significant increase in power, the GT2560Rs should do it. If you look at the maps, the GT2560R compressor does not give up much on the bottom end for a good bit more on the top end. I will be very interested to see the results either way, my project is slow moving and far from complete. I purchased my turbos from Todd at TCD, he is a great source.

[BerlinThunder]

I debated this question at length myself and will not know if I made the right choice until I get my car put together. They have changed the way they name the turbos, the GT2560R is what they used to call the GT28R. I have a pair of GT28Rs and the exhaust manifolds from a B10 BT. But I am planning for higher boost and more power than the B10 BT. If you want to keep the engine close to original just use the GT2554Rs, they are already an upgrade to the stock T25s and should be more responsive and provide better power potential. And they will be a more direct swap into a stock B10 BT. If you want a significant increase in power, the GT2560Rs should do it. If you look at the maps, the GT2560R compressor does not give up much on the bottom end for a good bit more on the top end. I will be very interested to see the results either way, my project is slow moving and far from complete. I purchased my turbos from Todd at TCD, he is a great source.

Thats exactly my problem. I don´t want to have a pair of turbos that start to spool up at 4k and makes the whole ride kind of uncomfortable but i also want a little increase in top end power..
I made a last test drive before i took of the engine in march. I hope to be ready end of the year. So my project moves the same speed like yours does .
This is what i want to do:

New Head studs,head gasket,turbos, new downpipes incl. new v-bands(??) I mean the connection between the turbine and the downpipe ... because the alpina ones are very limited ( small diameter ) and ...mine are cracked
The fuel delivery itself seems to be quite good but the lady runs a little rich so i have to look over this one too.
I want to take the cats and the middle box off and just use the back box...That´s about it...If you want to do your twinturbo setup the B10 way and need pics of the engine bay i´ll be glad to help you with this.


Alex

[Tusker]

Here you go...

[Rich in Tupelo]

Very nice car. Love that color.

[m5 killer]

just an introduction my name is roj i live in south london, my good friend alex aka berlin thunder told me about this site and its got some very interesting information on here very good site, like alex i also drive an alpina B10 bi-turbo which has a remap ecu and bigger injectors, uprated 5bar fuel pump, baileys dump valve, stainless steel custom exhaust,big brake conversion six pots with 360mm grooved ap disks, 18" bbs split rims and full alpina ice with rear screens, alpine dvd navigation,and freeview alpine tv tuner and ps2 i better stop on spec or i will be here all night, like alex im also very interested in what you guys think about what alex is planning to do

[Matt]

the Alpina E34 with Alpina rims is complete artistic mastery of the automotive form.

It doesn't even matter what's under the hood. I could just lick the paint on that car.

[altus22]

the Alpina E34 with Alpina rims is complete artistic mastery of the automotive form.

It doesn't even matter what's under the hood. I could just lick the paint on that car.

I agree. I can't believe they turned an e34 into that.

[russc]

Hey,
Since were talking B10 Bi's, how is Alpina handling fuel enrichment under boost? Is it all ECU tuning or is there a piggy-back addon for boost sensing, as the 179 can't do that. Just curious.

RussC

[BerlinThunder]

Hey,
Since were talking B10 Bi's, how is Alpina handling fuel enrichment under boost? Is it all ECU tuning or is there a piggy-back addon for boost sensing, as the 179 can't do that. Just curious.

RussC

The BiTurbo is Bosch Motronic 1.2 similair to the E34 M5 3.6. (If I read out the B10 BT the Diagnostic program says its a Motronic 1.2 for the E34 M5)

The electronic throttle body (EML) has it own ECU. Also the turbo pressure , it is regulated by a separate ECU (there are 4 in total in the right box under the hood. Ignition/injection, EML, ABS and turbo pressure).

Most sensors like coolant -, air temperature sensor and MAF are the same as the M5 3.6.
The turbo ECU is connected to the DME. Pin #3 of the DME is connected to pin #24 of the turbo ECU. The turbo ECU measures throttle position and turbo pressure.

On the diagrams the air temperature sensor and fuel switch (for adjusting the right fuel RON 95 or 98) are shown. Possible that the DME is sending that information to the turbo ECU.

Cheers Alex