MyE28.com

Hello all. I am going to be turboing my 535 and i figured I would make an attempt at a build thread. Its my second 535 and is not my daily so its time to put some love into. I have worked on these cars......extensively but i am not a mechanic and this is my first and probably only turbo build. Ive moved over here from bimmer because you guys just seem more friendly over all. I imagine i will have alot of dumb questions as i go through this so thanks in advance for any guidance. I have been trying to understand turbo theory for about a year and seriously got into about 3 months ago but it turns out its surprisingly complicated, imgine that. So Anyway here is where i stand.
I have the oil pan and timing covers off the car(both were leaking badly) and im sizing up where i should make my drain hole. im taking suggestions. Here is what i have:

Custom(some would say homemade) bottum mount log style manifold made from 321 stainless.
A beat up, mild steel downpipe.
An older Garret turbo. Dont know what it is exactly but the compressor is .70 and the turbine is .63.
An older chinese tial clone wastgate
(ALL THIS CAME AS A PACKAGE OFF ANOTHER 535. I realize its not all optimal but this is where im starting from.)
I also have a freshly rebuild head thats been all checked out
New Distributor, new rotor, new wires, new coil, new plugs
New bosch green giants
Arp head studs
Ebay oil feed and drain lines
New fuel filter
Miller MAF
Miller War Chip
miller turbo tune
I wanted to go mega squirt for the obvious reasons but my EML complicates things too much
I am waiting on a cometic Head Gasket

What i dont have and why
A 1:1 Fpr Id like to know just how much i really need to spend on this
Exhaust. I am hoping to Y the 3" downpipe into the duals but i dont know how thats gonna work yet
Intake. Gotta get everything else in and see what i have room for.
The T fitting to tap into the oil sending thing. Dont know what i need exactly yet.

Ill will hopfully get some pictures up in 3 or 4 days. I am planning on finishing this in about 2 weeks. If anyone has a suggestion about the parts i still dont have, that would be fantastic.

Welcome. Unfortunately I don't see a positive outcome to your project. You chose the worse possible platform (EML) and tuning device (Miller), and have what appears to be really crappy hardware.

Hey thanks man! Ill definately buy from you next time. Appreciate the input.

The stock fpr is 1:1 btw.

Also, stock bolts and headgasket will hold whatever your setup could possibles make.
Maybe save the cash there. Spend it on stuff that matters

Drain hole the oil pan is pretty standard.

I gotta disagree on the studs, get the studs. No matter what gasket you use studs will allow higher torque and better chance of survival. I just popped my hg again, this last one held for like 5 years. I'm using the stock bmw hg for an e34 m5(about $200.00 now) with studs @ 80# torque with gasket dope. I'm praying for no oil leaks this time. imho keeping your hg from popping is the biggest challenge with these motors and turbos. good luck!

Welcome.

Can't you just delete the EML crap?

demetk wrote:Welcome.

Can't you just delete the EML crap?

The car uses a different body harness and it's apparently very involved to do it.

Looks like the EML connections are limited to only 3 to the ecu, so it looks straightforward enough for a bypass.

demetk wrote:Looks like the EML connections are limited to only 3 to the ecu, so it looks straightforward enough for a bypass.

I briefly looked into it about 10 years ago and ran into some issue. It may be that some wiring also runs through the EML computer? Both engine and transmission? Can't remember.

Oh yea, I just saw the EML stuff in the ETM. Looks to be a bit more complex than I previously thought. So glad my 89 didn't have EML.

Thank's for the replys guys. Stock for is 1:1, that is good to know, glad I didn't buy one. I looked into eliminating the EML,but I really couldn't find much info on it, and the various info I did find all pointed to it's a giant PITA. Considered running megasquirt in parallel for quite some time but eventually I realized it would ultimately be pretty expensive, alot of work and messy. I then seriously considered doing the fpr route, did alot of research on it. I called begi to ask a couple questions and wound up talking to Corky Bell for about an hour and a half, super nice guy and said quite a few things I wasn't expecting. Began to realize that even with that crude method, doing it correctly was still going to be expensive. Thats when I took another look at Miller and decided that all things considered (money, work involved, flexibility, astetics) that's the way I'm gonna go. The manifold is all i was after when I purchased the one I have, and even if it hadn't included the downpipe, waste gate and turbo, I got it at a steal. Dude listed it wrong and it didn't show up on a typical search. no one else bid on it and I got it extremely cheap. It appears to be a dinan manifold clone, very well made and out of 321 stainless. The turbo and the waste gate appear to be in good condition so I will use then at low boost until I upgrade the clutch at which point I will upgrade other parts as needed. That is all the explaining I'm going to do for the choices I've made so please, I just want to move forward.
I already have the Cometic gasket and the studs so that is happening. I'm almost ready to take the head off. I'm not going to be machining the deck. I am aware of the risks with the MLS gaskets but I'm doing it. I would like info on the copper spray. I have seen don't spray it, spray the two sides, and take it apart and spray all the layers. Any thoughts on that? Head has been skimmed and looks like a mirror. As far as I know, it's never been overheated, the heads never been off, and the hg has never leaked, thinking it will be smooth enough.

Oh, almost forgot. For head studs, us the torquing procedure the same as with bolts? Is it motor specific or stud specific? Thanks again for any info.

Sorry, one more thing. Any thoughts on Miller's vclc?
I don't fully understand what it does and don't want to make this anymore complicated than I have to until it is running right. Is this thing worthwhile or just some dash bling?

You're really setting your self up for failure and headaches with all this motronic tuning crap. Trying to tune and modify what is essentially the stone age of ECUs is beyond me. You're car will drive better in every imaginable sense with a properly tuned standalone. With or without EML you should be able to correctly wire in an MS2 unit. Even if the EML wiring presents an issue, remove the harness and replace it with one from an e34 that doesn't have it. e34/e32 harnesses aren't terribly difficult to come by.

The Dinan turbo manifold was cast iron piece. It sounds like you have something put together with weld els and straight pipe. I would also dump the Chinese knock-off wastegate. That's not a component to go cheap on.

I've been running an MLS gasket with ARPs for about 10-11 years now without (knock on wood) any issues. I did not use any spray or sealant. Maybe Todd can chime in on the torque numbers and sequence. I remember them being different than the stock head bolts.

As far as the miller stuff goes its done. I have already bought it and there arent refunds so its a moot point. I have no doubts that there will be a significant amount of hassles getting this thing running right, thats just the way of the world. I also have no doubt that i will eventually get it running right, i have seen plenty of builds using miller that people are happy with and this is the direction i am taking. If that is a problem here due to sponsors or whatever, fine, i wont do the log, let me know.
I already have the manifold, i am not buying a new one, period. I only wish to ultimately get 350 wheel, i do not believe that the manifold or the tuning method will prevent me from doing that, and im, really not interested in hearing about how i messed up, im interested in moving foward. I seriously am starting wondering why i bothered with this. I have many hobbies and every time i go to a forum for advice its always the same. cynical people telling you what you did wrong so far, snarky comments about using the search button and my way is better than everyone elses, your dumb for doing it that way. It always works out in the end. Sure mistakes are made but i learn some things, its gets done in the end, im happy with and thats all part of the process for me, im not dropping 10 grand into a 4000 car to make eveyrone happy. I just want answers to a few detail questions here and there and to document this for someone like me in the future. I am not planning my build, thats already done. If this isnt okay here, let me know, and i wont post again. Thanks for the info about the bolts, it definately seems like something different. If anybody would like to give me the details on that, i would be grateful. i agree about the wastegate, and i probably will be getting one sooner rather than later but im not dumping iany more money into this until i get it running.

Don't listen to the negativity. I got criticized for using 'outdated' technology. Just do your own thing and please post your results. I would be interested to see how you fair.

good luck.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

You need to lighten the fuck up. No one spends time here trying or even wanting to put anyone down. You post saying you’re inexperience with forced induction as this is your first build. There aren't any forums sponsors, nor is there any particular brand allegiance. There is a ton of experience here primarily from people breaking stuff and then finding a better solution. The tuning platform is the single biggest hurdle and headache you’ll face with your build. More power to you if you want to walk uphill.

I don’t care what hardware you’re using. If the manifold is used and as I’ve described (ie, its been welded together) I would at the very least smoke test or leak the hardware prior to installation. The same goes for any other welded, used hardware that is upstream of the O2 sensor.

You’ve stated you want to use a y-pipe with what I assume would be the factory exhaust. I’m not sure you’re going to flow 400+hp through that muffler without creating significant back pressure. If your immediate goal is to “get the car running”, I would do a simple turn down on the downpipe without a muffler for the time being. It will be loud but not too crazy. Once time and budget allows, you can fabricate a proper exhaust from the downpipe back. That would save you the hassle of fabricating (or paying someone to fabricate) a y-pipe for what I believe will inhibit your power goal.

The highest pressure oil feed source for feeding the turbo is directly off of the oil filter housing. Just drill/tap the side of the housing or directly off the top of the lid. You can also pull off the back of the head where the oil pressure idiot light resides. I don't recall the size off the top of my head, I believe its M12x1.5. You can confirm the size by checking the crush washer size on the ETK.

Thanks for the info george, i will look into. I don't need to lighten up. I stated clearly in my first thread that i have already purchased these parts, but i continue to get nothing but dont use that, it sucks, your going to fail, you should buy blah blah blah. i have been very clear. This is what i am working with, those descisions have been made. I dont need people second guessing the toothpaste thats out of the tube. If you want to help me build it great! If you want to critique what i have already purchased, i am not interested. If we can get over that, then so be it. But thank you for the helpful info.

VegasMark wrote:Oh, almost forgot. For head studs, us the torquing procedure the same as with bolts? Is it motor specific or stud specific? Thanks again for any info.

Follow what is in the box from ARP. Specifications change with time, current is 30/60/90. I can post a picture of the sheet from my boxes or simply look at their website for a current install sheet.

VegasMark wrote:blah blah blah. i am not interested. If we can get over that, then so be it. But thank you for the helpful info.

I'm curious why you started this thread then. A fair amount of useful info has been supplied already and you decided you know better. To avoid the common mistakes many have made by needing to "run what you brung" means listening and throwing away some of the stuff bought on the cheap. My junk has been through 3 or 4 iterations since 2000, no useful experience here is there? TCD and many others, not much there either, right? You'd be wise to pay some attention and save some headaches and plenty of cash. Its your project do what you want, enjoy.

I will offer this one little bit of advise. Stand alone.

Ross
Dinan 6 (running BTW)

So the warchip & maf is $750
Weren't there threads about people getting that for the promise of ready to instal "boost maps" and custom tunes and shit
but nothing happened with that?

I remember using a begi for $250 and some cobra injectors, like $10 for an ebay chip that retarded timing.
ran 8psi stock clutch, stock reliably. AFR tuned perfectly. Beat the shit out of it daily for acouple years.

You already bought this stuff before you posted. Not talking shit just my suggestions for other ppl reading.

Go to the junkyard and get an e30 harness and buy a plug and play megasquirt.
That's probably the best thing for a noob to do because you will 100% want to turn the boost up.

Also, I want to see dynoes and vids of turbo guys actually running miller warchip.

Okay, so be it.

If you post your shit on forums don't cry because people are letting you know about better ways to do it.

No need to take peoples posts as attacks.

Thanks demetk, i was deluding myself to think this board was somehow different, might as well have some fun with it i suppose, trolls gonna troll.

Hit Man X, thank you sir, that is exactly what i needed to know.

Rossdinan6, since you are wondering. I started this thread to document the build i am doing. For the last oh, i dont know, 8 years so since i got my first e34, I have enjoyed reading about the different approaches people have taken to take there performance to the next level. From haris NA build to smallsnails freakshow to redfives sweet ride to the kid whos got like 1200 dollars for the whole build and does it all with junk yard parts and a harbor freight welder. I listened to attack eagle attack people, small snail pontificate, Shapeshifter get nasty and nikos and gianucci tout the superiority of the s38. I have read many offered of why tcd sucks, why miller sucks and brody is an a#@$%^*. I have read all about hoe dinan is crap and there stuff is overpriced and you should just buy the badge on ebay. Ive heard all about how you have to have to have coilovers, billies or konis or you aint %$#@. I have taken apart every system on these cars and when i say every, im not exagerating very much. I have replace control arms, cyclinder heads, injectors, seats, doors, windows, dash, gauge cluster, stereos, dogbones and beer cans, differentials, head lights, radiators, guibos, springs, struts. I have completely striped down and cleaned the elctronic throttle body, i have replaced o2 sensors, coils, rotors, caps, wires, plugs, abs sensors, CPS sensors, radiators, i have resealed the ac and replaced the compressor lines and condensor, the heater core, the rebuilt the heater valves, replaced motor mounts, a starter, water pumps and thermostates, the clutch master cyclinder and bled it, I replaced a subframe once as well. Oh yeah, i even stripped and redyed the seats one time. Im sure i am forgetting quite a few things but what eves. I am not saying this to impress you but to impress upon you that i have researched this extensively for the last year and a half, my descisions are thought out and have already been made and ive been extremely clear about that. I am not going to hack my car up for megasquirt if i dont have to to achieve the goal i am after and im pretty certain i dont have to.
Now once again i have a newly rebuilt head, a mls head gasket, new bosch 42#s, A nice looking manifold, a turbo and DP that came came off a running car, this car, i concede the wastegate sucks and will replace it due time. I bought one of the 3 major tuning systems that is used to tune this motor, and all things considered it was my best move in my opinion. Im replacing all gaskets, all hoses, all vacuum lines, all belts, etc etc and 80 percent of what im getting is you should throw away that 2000 you spent and buy this @#$% that i like, yours isnt going to work, your manifold that i havent seen sucks, you should buy one from me etc, etc. Now I get shadow coming on who apparently hasnt really read the thread very carefully saying im stupid for buying nice stuff, i should have made it out of junk, good lord, you sound like a ....disabled person. Now i get that some of guys like to listen to yourselves talk but if you cant stay focused on what going on, im just not interested. Im going to continue this build thread, and if you wanna troll, troll, but im much more interested in constructive thoughts. I dont take these posts as attacks, i just really dont understand what they are for other stroking your own egos. Anyhoo, this should be fun i guess. I forgot how much of a joy these things can be.

Would love to see a build thread ... hope the OP decides to do one after everything going on in here...

sixxxer wrote:Would love to see a build thread ... hope the OP decides to do one after everything going on in here...

Nothing is going on. This isn't Day Care. Ask questions and you will likely get educated answers. Sorry, if he bought a bunch of trash and doesn't want to hear about it.

L

Gonna try to get some pictures up today. Progress it what usually brings the adults out.

give

VegasMark wrote:You know Todd, there was a period there was I was going to buy a bunch of stuff from you, studs, injectors, chip, mayeven considered the manifold for a while despite its obvious flaws, but I just read too many posts implying you guys were just about the money and didn't GAF. I now see that I was wrong and definitely should have gone with TCD. Bummer man. we can keep going

Please post links to claimed posts because I have never heard anyone say something like that in 14 years. Arrogant asshole sure, but never greedy. Over the years there have been plenty of people who try to put me in my place by trying say I have lost sales. The real reason you have not purchased any parts from me is because you either can't afford to or think you can do it better for less. Good luck with that.

Truth be told, I do give a shit and that is why I bother to answer the same questions over and over and over. If I didn't care, I would just ignore people like you.