Turbo Kit And The Daily Driver
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Threeshifter
- Posts: 704
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
I have a daily driver 535i. I really like it. I plan on driving it from the current 188k to 280K or further. I am considering a turbo kit, probably a TCD, but would like some feedback on the subject of reliability for a daily driver car. I am looking a significant but moderate gain in Hp (+30-50 as opposed to 400).
Daily driving is great. Drives just like a NA car if you don't put your foot down. You can hear the turbo start to spool and all you have to do is ease off the gas to keep your gas mileage in line.
Sorry, but even with a TCD s1, you will be in the 300 hp range. If you don't want much power, don't go turbo.
Sorry, but even with a TCD s1, you will be in the 300 hp range. If you don't want much power, don't go turbo.
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Guest
[QUOTE="Duke M535Ti"]Daily driving is great. Drives just like a NA car if you don't put your foot down. You can hear the turbo start to spool and all you have to do is ease off the gas to keep your gas mileage in line.[/QUOTE]
One could just reset the wastegate to limit boost to a conservative 8 psi. Another possibility, install a Boost Controller and set it up with two settings. one for DD duty, the other for killing V-8s.
Rich
One could just reset the wastegate to limit boost to a conservative 8 psi. Another possibility, install a Boost Controller and set it up with two settings. one for DD duty, the other for killing V-8s.
Rich
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Bill in MN
- Posts: 1718
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
- Location: The Boonies, Mn
- Contact:
[QUOTE="Bill in MN"]Oh come on Duke, who you kidding? You're trying to tell me you drive your car w/o your foot in it most of the time??? Yeah, right
30 - 50hp are best gained NA with a chip, cam and other relatively inexpensive mods.[/QUOTE]
Yea...hard to do. I was getting 200 miles to a tank before I left. The car still need lots of tuning and is running way fat.
30-50 easy NA...........no way my friend. I got my Hartge headed NA engine to just under 260 HP with LOTS of mods and over 30 dyno pulls.
You MAY get 10 HP with a chip and 15 total with a cam and chip. Check my webpage for all of the mods to my NA engine. There is a reason why I went FI. Duke ain't stupid.
30 - 50hp are best gained NA with a chip, cam and other relatively inexpensive mods.[/QUOTE]
Yea...hard to do. I was getting 200 miles to a tank before I left. The car still need lots of tuning and is running way fat.
30-50 easy NA...........no way my friend. I got my Hartge headed NA engine to just under 260 HP with LOTS of mods and over 30 dyno pulls.
You MAY get 10 HP with a chip and 15 total with a cam and chip. Check my webpage for all of the mods to my NA engine. There is a reason why I went FI. Duke ain't stupid.
[QUOTE="Rich Euro M5"]
One could just reset the wastegate to limit boost to a conservative 8 psi. Another possibility, install a Boost Controller and set it up with two settings. one for DD duty, the other for killing V-8s.
Rich[/QUOTE]
I am at 8 psi right now and it is not conservative at all......................ask BNC. I would like to think that my engine is producing more HP than other TCD engines with 8 psi due to the specific turbo engine build, EM and Hartge head. Time and the dyno will tell.
One could just reset the wastegate to limit boost to a conservative 8 psi. Another possibility, install a Boost Controller and set it up with two settings. one for DD duty, the other for killing V-8s.
Rich[/QUOTE]
I am at 8 psi right now and it is not conservative at all......................ask BNC. I would like to think that my engine is producing more HP than other TCD engines with 8 psi due to the specific turbo engine build, EM and Hartge head. Time and the dyno will tell.
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Guest
[QUOTE="Rich Euro M5"]
One could just reset the wastegate to limit boost to a conservative 8 psi. Another possibility, install a Boost Controller and set it up with two settings. one for DD duty, the other for killing V-8s.
Rich[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE="Duke M535Ti"]I am at 8 psi right now and it is not conservative at all......................ask BNC. I would like to think that my engine is producing more HP than other TCD engines with 8 psi due to the specific turbo engine build, EM and Hartge head. Time and the dyno will tell.[/QUOTE]
Duke,
Remember that TCD sized the Turbo for pulling Big Boost. One could back off on the Compressor wheels Trim and achieve less dramatic effects, ie boost can be made at a lower RPM with a smaller turbo.
For example, the Mitsu TD04 in my Brick (2.3Liter) in stock form (14B Compressor) will only flow about 325 CFM and peters out at about 12 psi. I have an upgraded compressor wheel (14G ) and it's capable of 465 CFM and +20 PSI of Boost. Like Sweeney, I limit boost with the gauge and my foot. Boost comes on strong at 2500 rpm and WOT, but I've limited the output to 9 psi, the lower end has 275k on it.
Rich
One could just reset the wastegate to limit boost to a conservative 8 psi. Another possibility, install a Boost Controller and set it up with two settings. one for DD duty, the other for killing V-8s.
Rich[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE="Duke M535Ti"]I am at 8 psi right now and it is not conservative at all......................ask BNC. I would like to think that my engine is producing more HP than other TCD engines with 8 psi due to the specific turbo engine build, EM and Hartge head. Time and the dyno will tell.[/QUOTE]
Duke,
Remember that TCD sized the Turbo for pulling Big Boost. One could back off on the Compressor wheels Trim and achieve less dramatic effects, ie boost can be made at a lower RPM with a smaller turbo.
For example, the Mitsu TD04 in my Brick (2.3Liter) in stock form (14B Compressor) will only flow about 325 CFM and peters out at about 12 psi. I have an upgraded compressor wheel (14G ) and it's capable of 465 CFM and +20 PSI of Boost. Like Sweeney, I limit boost with the gauge and my foot. Boost comes on strong at 2500 rpm and WOT, but I've limited the output to 9 psi, the lower end has 275k on it.
Rich
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Threeshifter
- Posts: 704
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
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Guest
[QUOTE="Rich Euro M5"]
One could just reset the wastegate to limit boost to a conservative 8 psi. Another possibility, install a Boost Controller and set it up with two settings. one for DD duty, the other for killing V-8s.
Rich[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE="Duke M535Ti"]I am at 8 psi right now and it is not conservative at all......................ask BNC. I would like to think that my engine is producing more HP than other TCD engines with 8 psi due to the specific turbo engine build, EM and Hartge head. Time and the dyno will tell.[/QUOTE]
Duke,
You're going to be making more HP than just about everyone out there that simply bolts on a TCD kit. You have a ported head with big valves and you're running a MAP sensor, therefore you don't have the dreaded AFM. Add in the EM TEC3 Engine Management and stir. Yup, you're making serious Torque/HP, more like a 6.0 Liter engine.
Rich
One could just reset the wastegate to limit boost to a conservative 8 psi. Another possibility, install a Boost Controller and set it up with two settings. one for DD duty, the other for killing V-8s.
Rich[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE="Duke M535Ti"]I am at 8 psi right now and it is not conservative at all......................ask BNC. I would like to think that my engine is producing more HP than other TCD engines with 8 psi due to the specific turbo engine build, EM and Hartge head. Time and the dyno will tell.[/QUOTE]
Duke,
You're going to be making more HP than just about everyone out there that simply bolts on a TCD kit. You have a ported head with big valves and you're running a MAP sensor, therefore you don't have the dreaded AFM. Add in the EM TEC3 Engine Management and stir. Yup, you're making serious Torque/HP, more like a 6.0 Liter engine.
Rich
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Threeshifter
- Posts: 704
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
It will be some time before I pursue this project, but I will be doing research now.
My goal is to add Hp but have a very reliable daily driver and long tripper. This will be a platform to further build the car if I decide, so I like the idea of having the capacity for higher Hp.
Some time I will make it to an event where I can see an e28 turbo kit or two in person, preferably a TCD.
Does TCD have a showroom or take appointments for showing the kits/demo at their manufacturing location in Ohio?
[Edit by Threeshifter on [TIME]1127055480[/TIME]]
My goal is to add Hp but have a very reliable daily driver and long tripper. This will be a platform to further build the car if I decide, so I like the idea of having the capacity for higher Hp.
Some time I will make it to an event where I can see an e28 turbo kit or two in person, preferably a TCD.
Does TCD have a showroom or take appointments for showing the kits/demo at their manufacturing location in Ohio?
[Edit by Threeshifter on [TIME]1127055480[/TIME]]
[QUOTE="TCD"]Sounds like a S1 with base boost and exhaust would be perfect for your needs. It'll add about 100rwhp and be totally reliable. This is the setup Jeremy is running. Maybe he'll chime in.
Todd[/QUOTE]
i added roughly 80 rwhp running only 5 psi on the s1 kit before i did my recent conversion. let me tell you, it just wasn't enough!!!
Todd[/QUOTE]
i added roughly 80 rwhp running only 5 psi on the s1 kit before i did my recent conversion. let me tell you, it just wasn't enough!!!
Daily reliability is excellent. I'd say almost the same as a normally aspirated car. The only reason it's "almost" is because there's a few extra specialized parts in there. 
Any problems you have would likely be regular m30 driveability problems. Speed sensor may go, O2 sensor is flaky . . . that sort of thing.
My kit runs 9-10psi and is very strong and smooth as hell. People who don't know it's a turbo just think it's fast. Long duration cruising is unchanged. I drove ~900 miles in one day to 5erFest and had no problems. It returns the same and sometimes slightly better fuel economy as well. If I could keep my foot off the happy pedal, I'm sure I'd do better.
Don't listen to these guys telling you 5psi is nothing and you should go for 18psi. 5psi on a lead slug like an e34 may not do much, but 10psi on the ligher e28 is a real kick in the shorts.
As for how much more power it will give you, I should have a more definite answer for that later in the week.
Jeremy
Any problems you have would likely be regular m30 driveability problems. Speed sensor may go, O2 sensor is flaky . . . that sort of thing.My kit runs 9-10psi and is very strong and smooth as hell. People who don't know it's a turbo just think it's fast. Long duration cruising is unchanged. I drove ~900 miles in one day to 5erFest and had no problems. It returns the same and sometimes slightly better fuel economy as well. If I could keep my foot off the happy pedal, I'm sure I'd do better.
Don't listen to these guys telling you 5psi is nothing and you should go for 18psi. 5psi on a lead slug like an e34 may not do much, but 10psi on the ligher e28 is a real kick in the shorts.
As for how much more power it will give you, I should have a more definite answer for that later in the week.
Jeremy
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Craig -535i- Seattle
- Posts: 155
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
[QUOTE="Jeremy"]Don't listen to these guys telling you 5psi is nothing and you should go for 18psi. 5psi on a lead slug like an e34 may not do much, but 10psi on the ligher e28 is a real kick in the shorts.[/QUOTE]
I think 5psi on a "lead slug" like an E34 might surprise a few people, nonetheless.
Who is this Craig guy Anyway?
I think 5psi on a "lead slug" like an E34 might surprise a few people, nonetheless.
Who is this Craig guy Anyway?
[QUOTE="Jeremy"]Don't listen to these guys telling you 5psi is nothing and you should go for 18psi. 5psi on a lead slug like an e34 may not do much, but 10psi on the ligher e28 is a real kick in the shorts.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE="Craig -535i- Seattle"]I think 5psi on a "lead slug" like an E34 might surprise a few people, nonetheless.
Who is this Craig guy Anyway? [/QUOTE]
Craig,
Where you been? I got a call from the shop working on your ex 535i. Who did you sell it to? What are driving now?
Todd
[QUOTE="Craig -535i- Seattle"]I think 5psi on a "lead slug" like an E34 might surprise a few people, nonetheless.
Who is this Craig guy Anyway? [/QUOTE]
Craig,
Where you been? I got a call from the shop working on your ex 535i. Who did you sell it to? What are driving now?
Todd
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bahnstormer
- Posts: 212
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
according to one of todds emails tcd s1 that is to say non intercooled is safe to run to approx 7.5psi
so if andrew is dynoing at 5psi 255hp at the wheels then you should be up to about 270ish wheel
with 6-7psi...
that is around 300 crank hp which is on a 3500lbs car about as fast as a new 350z or a g35
(which are similar in displacement)
so if andrew is dynoing at 5psi 255hp at the wheels then you should be up to about 270ish wheel
with 6-7psi...
that is around 300 crank hp which is on a 3500lbs car about as fast as a new 350z or a g35
(which are similar in displacement)
[QUOTE="bahnstormer"]according to one of todds emails tcd s1 that is to say non intercooled is safe to run to approx 7.5psi
so if andrew is dynoing at 5psi 255hp at the wheels then you should be up to about 270ish wheel
with 6-7psi...
that is around 300 crank hp which is on a 3500lbs car about as fast as a new 350z or a g35
(which are similar in displacement)[/QUOTE]
Safe on a m30b35? You can run up to 10/11psi non intercooled pretty easily with proper tuning. BTW Andrew's car ran 97mph at 5psi in the 1/4. 8psi should be ~100mph which is respecatable even by today's standards. I suspect he'll run 107-108 with his current setup.
Todd
so if andrew is dynoing at 5psi 255hp at the wheels then you should be up to about 270ish wheel
with 6-7psi...
that is around 300 crank hp which is on a 3500lbs car about as fast as a new 350z or a g35
(which are similar in displacement)[/QUOTE]
Safe on a m30b35? You can run up to 10/11psi non intercooled pretty easily with proper tuning. BTW Andrew's car ran 97mph at 5psi in the 1/4. 8psi should be ~100mph which is respecatable even by today's standards. I suspect he'll run 107-108 with his current setup.
Todd
[QUOTE="bahnstormer"]according to one of todds emails tcd s1 that is to say non intercooled is safe to run to approx 7.5psi
so if andrew is dynoing at 5psi 255hp at the wheels then you should be up to about 270ish wheel
with 6-7psi...
that is around 300 crank hp which is on a 3500lbs car about as fast as a new 350z or a g35
(which are similar in displacement)[/QUOTE]
Careful there, the b34 and b35 make different amounts of hp per pound of boost due to the static compression difference and changes in the intake tract. I'm not sure whose car your talking about with the 7.5psi.
Also, keep in mind that that new 350Z or G35 make those power numbers very high in the rev range. A turbo M30 will have loads more torque at a lower rpm. Thus, even if the motors have the same peak hp rating, and the cars weigh exactly the same, the turbo car will win the race every time.
Jeremy
so if andrew is dynoing at 5psi 255hp at the wheels then you should be up to about 270ish wheel
with 6-7psi...
that is around 300 crank hp which is on a 3500lbs car about as fast as a new 350z or a g35
(which are similar in displacement)[/QUOTE]
Careful there, the b34 and b35 make different amounts of hp per pound of boost due to the static compression difference and changes in the intake tract. I'm not sure whose car your talking about with the 7.5psi.
Also, keep in mind that that new 350Z or G35 make those power numbers very high in the rev range. A turbo M30 will have loads more torque at a lower rpm. Thus, even if the motors have the same peak hp rating, and the cars weigh exactly the same, the turbo car will win the race every time.
Jeremy
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Craig -535i- Seattle
- Posts: 155
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
[QUOTE="TCD"]Craig,
Where you been? I got a call from the shop working on your ex 535i. Who did you sell it to? What are driving now?
Todd[/QUOTE]
I sold it to a local guy that was looking for a project. We adopted a baby at the end of March, which was about 6 months sooner than we expected to. As a result I had no time to finish the final 10% on the car. The guy made me a great offer on it, so I took it.
I've got a '97 M3/4 now which is nice because it's 100% stock.
Now the baby is getting older (6 months next week) and I'm getting a project itch again.... :p
Despite the fact that the b35 engine is just so much better than the b34, if (when?) I do this again it's probably going to be on an E28. This time around I think pulling the engine and doing it right is the path I'll take though. Laying on the ground that much gets old after a while.
[Edit by Craig -535i- Seattle on [TIME]1127233438[/TIME]]
Where you been? I got a call from the shop working on your ex 535i. Who did you sell it to? What are driving now?
Todd[/QUOTE]
I sold it to a local guy that was looking for a project. We adopted a baby at the end of March, which was about 6 months sooner than we expected to. As a result I had no time to finish the final 10% on the car. The guy made me a great offer on it, so I took it.
I've got a '97 M3/4 now which is nice because it's 100% stock.
Now the baby is getting older (6 months next week) and I'm getting a project itch again.... :p
Despite the fact that the b35 engine is just so much better than the b34, if (when?) I do this again it's probably going to be on an E28. This time around I think pulling the engine and doing it right is the path I'll take though. Laying on the ground that much gets old after a while.
[Edit by Craig -535i- Seattle on [TIME]1127233438[/TIME]]
[QUOTE="bahnstormer"]according to one of todds emails tcd s1 that is to say non intercooled is safe to run to approx 7.5psi
so if andrew is dynoing at 5psi 255hp at the wheels then you should be up to about 270ish wheel
with 6-7psi...
that is around 300 crank hp which is on a 3500lbs car about as fast as a new 350z or a g35
(which are similar in displacement)[/QUOTE]
i have been in a certain e28 running 15 psi
. thing was fast as fuck!
so if andrew is dynoing at 5psi 255hp at the wheels then you should be up to about 270ish wheel
with 6-7psi...
that is around 300 crank hp which is on a 3500lbs car about as fast as a new 350z or a g35
(which are similar in displacement)[/QUOTE]
i have been in a certain e28 running 15 psi
. thing was fast as fuck!
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Bill in MN
- Posts: 1718
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- Location: The Boonies, Mn
- Contact: