M5 Timing chain question

RonP · Post by **RonP** » Apr 02, 2006 4:38 PM

Can you put a new chain in or does the timing chain have a link like a bike chain? I want to put a new chain on the $500 M5, but don't want to take apart the entire front end to do so. Will this work?

Devinder · Post by **Devinder** » Apr 02, 2006 5:57 PM

I just bought an OEM (Iwis) chain for my M5 and it's endless. There may be other manufacturers who make a master-link chain.

Devinder

Steve Haygood · Post by **Steve Haygood** » Apr 02, 2006 10:48 PM

I can supply with the non endless chain,but the problem is the guide and a brittle guide won't be helped by a new chain. If you don't want to do it right..... I guess this is better that not doing it at all, but if it breaks, don't say I didn't warn you.

Duke · Post by **Duke** » Apr 02, 2006 11:38 PM

I thought that most failures are due to the guides breaking which leads to chain failure. BTW, it does not matter how many miles the engine has on it. The guides break due to age and the plastic getting brittle, not milage. So, if you have a low mile M5, you need to replace the guides and chain anyway.

lkfoster · Post by **lkfoster** » Apr 03, 2006 12:27 AM

The guide on my '88 when I did it a few months ago wasn't brittle, but the locating slots were virtually worn through from the chain bouncing back and forth. I had no idea how loose the chain had gotten in 173k miles until starting the engine up with everything new. Apparently the tensioner can only go so far and then the chain is free to bounce around at will. I can now hear gear box rattle in neutral that I haven't heard for at least 10 years.

RonP · Post by **RonP** » Apr 03, 2006 1:22 AM

The car has 290k on it and it looks like the guides are fine, although I may replace them anyway, but the chain is noisy until the car warms up a bit.

Duke · Post by **Duke** » Apr 03, 2006 3:49 AM

RonP wrote:The car has 290k on it and it looks like the guides are fine, although I may replace them anyway, but the chain is noisy until the car warms up a bit.

Check the chain tensioner piston and spring.

Madhungarian · Post by **Madhungarian** » Apr 03, 2006 2:22 PM

Check the chain tensioner piston and spring

Duke is right, inexpensive part, 5 min to replace and they do fail btw. Good first line of defense.

Rich Euro M5 · Post by **Rich Euro M5** » Apr 03, 2006 2:24 PM

RonP wrote:The car has 290k on it and it looks like the guides are fine, although I may replace them anyway, but the chain is noisy until the car warms up a bit.

Ron,

My M88/3 exhibited similar noises, except mine only made some sound during start. Once the oil pressue was up no more noises and then the chain broke, don't know what caused it.

My engine builder who has mucho experience with everything ///M recommends 75K as the replacement point for everything in the timing chain area on ///M engines with simplex (single row) timing chains. Based on your mileage, you're 100K miles over my indy mechanics recommendation.

FWIW: The odometer on my Euro M5 shows 107k Miles.

Rich

RonP · Post by **RonP** » Apr 03, 2006 3:54 PM

Thanks for the info guys, I am going to replace the chain, guides, and tensioner and do a valve adjustment before Bimmerfest.

Steve Haygood · Post by **Steve Haygood** » Apr 03, 2006 4:03 PM

you better get busy

.... I would suggest an oil pump as well with that many miles, Let me know if I can help. I am in the middle of 4 M engine builds of different degrees right now. In addition I have the parts available

scottiesharpe · Post by **scottiesharpe** » Apr 04, 2006 12:06 AM

What's this I hear about a $500 M5 ???

Duke · Post by **Duke** » Apr 04, 2006 12:11 AM

scottiesharpe wrote:What's this I hear about a $500 M5 ???

Not any more...............the chain replacement will be close to 2X that. Want to hear about my $175 M535i?

greagin · Post by **greagin** » Apr 04, 2006 2:23 PM

i would love to hear about your $175 M535i

Rich Euro M5 · Post by **Rich Euro M5** » Apr 04, 2006 4:45 PM

Rich Euro M5 wrote:
RonP wrote:The car has 290k on it and it looks like the guides are fine, although I may replace them anyway, but the chain is noisy until the car warms up a bit.
Ron,

My M88/3 exhibited similar noises, except mine only made some sound during start. Once the oil pressue was up no more noises and then the chain broke, don't know what caused it.

My engine builder who has mucho experience with everything ///M recommends 75K as the replacement point for everything in the timing chain area on ///M engines with simplex (single row) timing chains. Based on your mileage, you're 100K miles over my indy mechanics recommendation.

FWIW: The odometer on my Euro M5 shows 107k Miles.

Rich

Ron,

I didn't realize you were talking about the $500 M5. I don't believe you have to worry about the chain breaking. But Duke's points should be taken seriously. In fact give Scottie Sharpe a call, he suffered a catastrophic (as in grenaded engine) failure of a plastic chain guide which subsequently caused the destruction of the engine.

Rich

rcbmw · Post by **rcbmw** » Apr 04, 2006 5:08 PM

There should be little discussion or debate as to which parts should be replaced during this repair. In my view the repair is properly completed only when all of the associated parts are replaced with the correct OEM pieces. I am tired of seeing cars that have been screwed up by poor work.

Best,
RCBMW

Rich Euro M5 · Post by **Rich Euro M5** » Apr 04, 2006 6:06 PM

rcbmw wrote:There should be little discussion or debate as to which parts should be replaced during this repair. In my view the repair is properly completed only when all of the associated parts are replaced with the correct OEM pieces. I am tired of seeing cars that have been screwed up by poor work.

Best,
RCBMW

RCBMW,

I concur, everything in the timing chain path should be replaced. I just wanted to clarify that it's uncommon for the duplex timing chain to break. As Duke pointed out it's typically the plastic guides that are responsible for most S38 destruction.

Rich

BDK · Post by **BDK** » Apr 05, 2006 11:01 PM

Not any more...............the chain replacement will be close to 2X that. Want to hear about my $175 M535i?

and what do you have in it now???

I think Ron and you are even...

Your's needed a battery to start,
his needed a fender..

seems about equal to me.....

not to mention what has been done since then....

Love ya

Duke · Post by **Duke** » Apr 09, 2006 12:17 AM

BNC wrote: Your's needed a battery to start,
his needed a fender..

Love ya

Nope, it needed a battery and a starter.

Back at ya. I have about $500 in the car right now

Hey, when ya gonna sell then E30 M-tech II kit?

Philo · Post by **Philo** » Apr 12, 2006 1:40 AM

Better buy that big mother torque wrench....

http://phil.infostreet.com/M5_Images/ca ... 300070.JPG
http://phil.infostreet.com/M5_Images/ca ... 300072.JPG
http://phil.infostreet.com/M5_Images/ca ... CT0017.JPG

on the last pic note the small freeze plug that's all beat up. This was found in the bottom of my cam chain cover and it fell out onto my driveway when I popped the cover off. I guess at some point someone tried to remove the plug and it fell into the cam chain well. Man..., starting the engine after that incident must made the guy's ass pucker up big time.

Philo.

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M5 Timing chain question

M5 Timing chain question

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