In the spirit of "pissing contests" e28 vs e39

[T_C_D]

I just bought another 5er and it isn't an e28. It's a 2000 528i Sport with 5 speed auto tranny.

For anybody who says they prefer the e28 to the e39 Get you head examined. If you cannot afford on that's one thing but to say that an e28 is a better daily driver is just nuts.

My 528i Sport has everything that e28 enthusuasts go nuts about.

- MTech suspension
- Proper BBS wheels (Staggered Style 5s in my case)
- Shadowline trim
- Great inline six

and some things that an e28 doesn't have.

- ice cold a/c
- great fuel economy
- fantastic automatic transmission
- large trunk
- good sound system
- zero wind noise
- rigid unibody
- proper negative camber
- all aluminum subframes and suspension
- all aluminum engine
- seating for two kids and an infant car seat in the rear
- airbag protection front and doors

This is absolutley the most refined and efficient BMW I have ever owned. Once we boost it it will be an amazing machine.

Go ahead and post all the cooling system failures and w/e else you like. As far as I am concerned those "problems" are just routine maintenance kinda like replacing brake rotors and lower control arm bushings every year on the e28.

Don't get me wrong, I love e28s and will own another again but a boosted e28 is more akin to a muscle car than a refined sedan.

Everyone should consider skipping the e34 and moving "up" to the e39 when the time comes.

BTW, I stole it for $8800 because the dealer thought it had major a front end problem but it only had a tire coming apart.



Oh and Duke, my 528i Sport at 10psi will be quicker and faster than your M535i.

[Duke]

Oh and Duke, my 528i Sport at 10psi will be quicker and faster than your M535i.

Sorry, not falling for it. Have fun with your tank .

[JoshInAtlanta]

Nice car. The sport package really sets it off.

[T_C_D]

Sorry, not falling for it. Have fun with your tank .

3549lbs

Certainly a much better weight to cubic foot ratio than the e28. Plus the unsprung weight is so much less than an e28 that it handles much better despite the 300lb weight difference.

[Duke]

3549lbs

Certainly a much better weight to cubic foot ratio than the e28. Plus the unsprung weight is so much less than an e28 that it handles much better despite the 300lb weight difference.

I must say that I am surprised that it weighs that little. The E39 M5 is over 4000 lbs though. I had the opportunity to drive a E39 M5 on the interstate and it was a very nice ride. My 04 A6 is way quiet too, no guts though.

Good luck with your................ummmmm......troop carrier then .

[T_C_D]

I must say that I am surprised that it weighs that little. The E39 M5 is over 4000 lbs though.

It'll be faster than an e39 M5. Figure 340rwhp/350rwtq and 400 fewer pounds.

[Cybersist535is]

well it looks nice, but i still like the e28's look.

enjoy the car

[chrism]

How do you get your lower control arm bushings to last that long?

Go ahead and post all the cooling system failures and w/e else you like. As far as I am concerned those "problems" are just routine maintenance kinda like replacing brake rotors and lower control arm bushings every year on the e28.

[Wiseguy]

Todd,

Flip it for a profit, and buy a 97-98 with the Iron block engine and none of this EWS3 nonsense.

[Joe in FL]

I love the E39, and agree with all of Todd's points. I don't want a payment, so I've resisted the impulse to sell the E28 and grab an E39, but I'm sure one of these days the impulse will get the best of me...

Nice find.

[T_C_D]

Todd,

Flip it for a profit, and buy a 97-98 with the Iron block engine and none of this EWS3 nonsense.

This car is ding free and in excellent condition. I want the m52tu engine as it is superior for power and 85lbs lighter. The 5 speed automatic is also very important to me.

I am embracing the new technology and trying to work with it rather than shy away from it. BMWs are only getting more complicated and I am sick of being years behind the times.

Certainly there is bigger risk of expensive failures but I am willing to accept them especially since I got such a smoking deal on the car.

Todd

[bimmerboy]

oh boy. sorry todd but that one might set you back a notch. dont worry youre still pretty high.

dad had that same exact car. i absolutely HATED it.
no soul, no fun, absolutely effortless driving/performance.
yes it was fast, and yes it handled well. and it rode nicely. but who cares? you couldnt tell if you were using that speed or that handling so whats the point. i thought that was the point of a BMW? and it just didnt feel solid like an e28.

but youre money i guess, youre call. personally i like my '02 and e28s.

[Steve in No Va]

My dad had a 2002 530i with the sport package and an automatic that was a shade darker silver. It was a nice car. He sold it and got an Infiniti M45, which he likes better. The trunk can't carry much compared to the E28. He always complained that he couldn't fit a set of golf clubs in except diagonally while the e28 fits a few bags easily. Also, it went through very expensive tires very quickly due to the weight, the camber and the staggered set up nixing any rotating of the tires. Expect them to last about 7-10,000 miles at $150-250 a piece.

It had a very comfortable ride and would be a lot more fun with a stronger engine. But don't expect maintenance to be less expensive than the e28. Especially as the miles get up there.

[Skeen]

Nice, that will be quite the sleeper when you get it boosted.

[Mike W.]

I usually don't even look at the FI forum, but had to today when I saw it renamed. Regardless. I've got a 97 E39 528i and thought I'd throw in my .02.

It's got a good engine and chassis, with the A/T, it feels the same acceleration wise as my 5 speed 535i. It's been pretty reliable in the year and a half we've had it, and it gets pretty good mileage, especially at high speeds due to it's shape and likely more.

But it drives me crazy. The HVAC is absolutely maddening. Even on manual it isn't in manual. You set the blower speed and it decides where it thinks you want it. The heater is downright crappy and while the A/C will keep you cool enough anywhere this side of Venus, it's not easy to stay comfortable with it. I'm constantly having to change it back to what I want. Seats are so so, actually not to bad on long trips, but never all that comfortable. The trunk is maybe 2/3 the size of an E28. It does have the nice fold down back seat, but still the trunk is small. Smaller than an E21. The back seat is smallish, but the doors are huge. And heavy. To use the cruise control you have to push a button on the dash, which I can't see unless I move my head a ways, then push a button on the steering wheel. Nothing so simple as just pushing on a lever without taking your eyes off the road. It's got a GM auto tranny that doesn't work as well as an old ZF4HP22. Huge blind spots front and rear. The bloody key is almost 4 inches long and over half an inch thick. It's bigger than my keycase with several keys in it, not good in my pocket. But it's a "smart" key, so it's more than a key so you can't just get a regular copy. There's not even a keyhole in the passenger door, talk about cheap... It's a luxury car, that is capable, not a sports sedan, well equiped.

It's my wife's car and she loves it. I respect it's capabilities, but really don't much like it. It won't do what I tell it and I figure it should if I'm paying the bills.

[chrism]

I always wondered why BMW put a diagram instructing people how to load golfbags into the trunk.

Staggared tires can be swapped from left to right. Thats right Sally, dismount, swap and presto improved treadware.

My dad had a 2002 530i with the sport package and an automatic that was a shade darker silver. It was a nice car. He sold it and got an Infiniti M45, which he likes better. The trunk can't carry much compared to the E28. He always complained that he couldn't fit a set of golf clubs in except diagonally while the e28 fits a few bags easily. Also, it went through very expensive tires very quickly due to the weight, the camber and the staggered set up nixing any rotating of the tires. Expect them to last about 7-10,000 miles at $150-250 a piece.

It had a very comfortable ride and would be a lot more fun with a stronger engine. But don't expect maintenance to be less expensive than the e28. Especially as the miles get up there.

[skip535i]

I've driven an early 528i and a late 530i and didn't like either one of them. D the seats. d the HVAC controls, they drove me NUTS. d the mirrors.

But I freaking LOVE the way they look. I would drive a late 540i or M5...that's it.

otherwise, I'll stick with my trustworthy e28!!

[MXH_RHD]

Congratulations Todd, I'm sure you'll enjoy the car.
I recently bought an E39 estate for my wife to transport my 10 week old daughter around. They are indeed a fantastic 'car' on a different level completely to the E28.

However, if it's pure driving enjoyment then the TWeRp wins every time
Besides, you'll never get that look of utter bemusement from people in their expensive 'fast' cars as you leave them for dead in something (that appears to be) long overdue it's last swing on a scrapyard crame

[wkohler]

I think they're a nice car - not crazy about the seats though - which is why we didn't buy a very similar car, but in alpine with a 5 speed. My mom couldn't stand the lack of thigh support - even after adjusting rake, etc. Park it next to what replaced it and I'll take one.

[shifty]

A year or two ago, I wanted an '02 or '03 540i 6-speed or a '99 - '01 740i Sport. I realized they'd be a little bit too expensive for my income right now and stopped looking at them.

Now, if you develop a turbo kit for a first-gen X5 3.0 (so I can get one with a stick) or for an E32 or E38 740i, then I may just end up buying a newer car.

Keep us posted on your R&D, Todd. E39s are part of the last run of Bimmers that actually looked good!

[cgraff]

A year or two ago, I wanted an '02 or '03 540i 6-speed or a '99 - '01 740i Sport. I realized they'd be a little bit too expensive for my income right now and stopped looking at them.

Now, if you develop a turbo kit for a first-gen X5 3.0 (so I can get one with a stick) or for an E32 or E38 740i, then I may just end up buying a newer car.

Keep us posted on your R&D, Todd. E39s are part of the last run of Bimmers that actually looked good!

There's a bunch of supercharger kits out there for the V8s. All reasonably good. Dinan's of course has a lot of R&D into it and I believe are even CARB certified. ESS also seems to have a decent rep for those as well, from what I've heard.

But given the fact that Todd's already got an M50 turbo'd, I wonder how much more it'd take to get an iron block M52 turbo'd. OBD2 magic?

I wouldn't touch the M54s with a turbo. Well...maybe very low pressure, but those motors are very stressed as it is from the factory. The 3.0 M54 is a known oil consumer. Long stroke, all-aluminum block. The 2.5 is probably slightly more robust in the long term.

I have to say though, that the M54s for use in daily driver E39s and E46s are very nice, all-around package.

-Chris

[T_C_D]

My e39 has the m52tu which is all aluminum and double vanos. We have hardware for it already just working on the programming.

As a side note, we'll have OBD2 m52, s52 programming by the end of the year.

Todd

[Duke]

As a side note, we'll have OBD2 m52, s52 programming by the end of the year.

How are you doing this? I know MS can not run double vanos. Are you using a piggyback, chip?

[Azure]

Grats Todd - if that's your taste, then more power to ya.

Personally I dislike anything quieter and softer that separates me further from the road, and that's been my experience with all the newer 5s.

Although I'm curious - you say the e39 has less unsprung weight, how so?

[vance]

Although I'm curious - you say the e39 has less unsprung weight, how so?

all aluminum subframes and suspension

Vance

[T_C_D]

As a side note, we'll have OBD2 m52, s52 programming by the end of the year.

How are you doing this? I know MS can not run double vanos. Are you using a piggyback, chip?

Programming the stock ecu. We finally found a viable software partner!

[Duke]

Programming the stock ecu. We finally found a viable software partner!

That’s cool and HUGE for OBD II cars. OBD II is quite the nemesis for the guys trying to FI their cars on Bimmer Forums.

[L_N_Love]

Nice car Todd and what a deal! Silly dealers....(only a bad tire....geez!)

[Mike W.]

all aluminum subframes and suspension

Even the shocks are aluminum bodied. A shock's only what, maybe 8 pounds? How much weight can be saved past the steel piston and hydraulic oil in there? Cool in a way, but how much for how much?

I forgot to mention, it is very quiet, even at hyperlegal speeds, but it's still a BMW and you can still hear that 6 cylinder engine when you're on it.

[Wiseguy]

Programming the stock ecu. We finally found a viable software partner!

That’s cool and HUGE for OBD II cars. OBD II is quite the nemesis for the guys trying to FI their cars on Bimmer Forums.

O rly?