Which harnesses did you utilize for this swap?
Wiring harness and pigtail (fusebox/ECU ones)?
Terry
Did you have to match wiring harness with pigtail with ECU?
M30b35 engine swap for the KILR5ER...dyno/turbo upgrade
-
Terry Mustoe
- Posts: 281
- Joined: Jul 08, 2006 7:13 PM
- Location: Wet and wild Washington state
Re: b35
I used a E34 auto 535i harness.
What are you asking for the rest? What do you mean by "pigtail"?
On your last, the ECU will have to match the harness at the connector for the ECU! That should be pretty straight forward.
RussC
What are you asking for the rest? What do you mean by "pigtail"?
On your last, the ECU will have to match the harness at the connector for the ECU! That should be pretty straight forward.
RussC
Terry Mustoe wrote:Which harnesses did you utilize for this swap?
Wiring harness and pigtail (fusebox/ECU ones)?
Terry
Did you have to match wiring harness with pigtail with ECU?
-
SilverBullet
- Posts: 120
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
- Location: brisbane, australia
The harness i used was out of the e34 535 that came with the motor. I had the e28 fuse box plug adapted to the e34 harness.
The water temp gauge hasnt worked since ive done the swap. I did not realise that the ecu used the coolant temp, and i wanted to no the temp of the engine. It seemed the easiest way to add another gauge and sensor. The sensor should go straight to the ecu so it shouldnt matter if the gauge doesnt work, rite? The car goes hard now as is so i will have to get the sensor back in. Thanks for your help!
The water temp gauge hasnt worked since ive done the swap. I did not realise that the ecu used the coolant temp, and i wanted to no the temp of the engine. It seemed the easiest way to add another gauge and sensor. The sensor should go straight to the ecu so it shouldnt matter if the gauge doesnt work, rite? The car goes hard now as is so i will have to get the sensor back in. Thanks for your help!
Wait, which sensor are we taking about, the temp sensor for the ECU or the dash temp sensor. The dash gauge wont work with the stock E34 gauge sensor. You have to put the E28 dash sensor in the engine and graft the E28 conn to the E34 harness. The temp sensor the ECU uses are the same for both E28 and E34SilverBullet wrote:The harness i used was out of the e34 535 that came with the motor. I had the e28 fuse box plug adapted to the e34 harness.
The water temp gooahj hasnt worked since ive done the swap. I did not realise that the ecu used the coolant temp, and i wanted to no the temp of the engine. It seemed the easiest way to add another gauge and sensor. The sensor should go straight to the ecu so it shouldnt matter if the gauge doesnt work, rite? The car goes hard now as is so i will have to get the sensor back in. Thanks for your help!
RussC
-
SilverBullet
- Posts: 120
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
- Location: brisbane, australia
I so cant wait til i understand electrics!!!!!
Ok so the dash gauge and the ecu DONT use the same sensor. I had a look in the manual and it just said the one with the brown body is the one for the gauge, problem is both mine are black. So im assuming the one closest to the rad. hose is for the gauge and the sensor closest to the block is the one for the ecu? The one closest to the rad. hose is the one i have remove and put an after market sensor in with gauge. I just assumed that it wasnt wired up properly when the conversion was done, it just seemed easiest to not have to trace wiring with shitty wiring diagrams that dont match my harness.
Also wat the hell does the OBC code protect do? Does it stop that warning light on my dash from flashing or should i just take out the bulb :p
Ok so the dash gauge and the ecu DONT use the same sensor. I had a look in the manual and it just said the one with the brown body is the one for the gauge, problem is both mine are black. So im assuming the one closest to the rad. hose is for the gauge and the sensor closest to the block is the one for the ecu? The one closest to the rad. hose is the one i have remove and put an after market sensor in with gauge. I just assumed that it wasnt wired up properly when the conversion was done, it just seemed easiest to not have to trace wiring with shitty wiring diagrams that dont match my harness.
Also wat the hell does the OBC code protect do? Does it stop that warning light on my dash from flashing or should i just take out the bulb :p
The OBC code and warning light on the dash have nothing to do with each other. The former is an anti-theft feature that disables the ECU and the latter is telling you to refer to the check control panel.SilverBullet wrote:Also wat the hell does the OBC code protect do? Does it stop that warning light on my dash from flashing or should i just take out the bulb :p
-
SilverBullet
- Posts: 120
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
- Location: brisbane, australia
-
SilverBullet
- Posts: 120
- Joined: Feb 12, 2006 12:00 PM
- Location: brisbane, australia
Next weekend im puttin the car on a dyno just to check the AFR and the accuracy of the tacho.I'm having the same problem on my '88 520i (E34) that's been rebuilt to a '90 M5 3.6 - the rev limit is at 6500rpm. I found this topic when googling for "M5 speed signal pin 29".M535 E28 wrote:ok, what i've been told was completely crap
today i connected the plug coming from the "tempo" pin behind the speedometer, to the black/white going to the ecu (pin 29)...
and guess what: my rev limiter climbed at 7500 rpm
so, there's no problem at all
stefan
My problem is that I'm using the M5 wiring harness on the engine and in the engine compartment. Two of the connectors to the instrument cluster comes from the M5 wiring harness. The two others from the coupé - which is still the old 520i harness, and they don't fit the M5 instrument cluster, which means the ECU lacks the speed signal (as well as the speedometer not working).
Can I put the brown one on the sensor in the differential to ground and connect the other one directly to the ECU pin 29?
Sorry if I am way OT - I can create a new topic if necessary. I've tried a lot of other forums with no luck.
Well gents, Ive made the pluge and losing more Dinan equipment to upgrade the parts that seem lacking now. I discussed it with TCD and we came to the conclusion this old TO4B H3 trim turbo from the 80s is limiting the powerplant output and is a dog of a spooler Plus the Dinan manifold is a bit more restrictive than the TCD unit. So I made the plunge and upgrading both units.
First is the turbo, TO4E, P-Trim exhaust wheel, 0.68 exhaust housing, 0.70 compressor housing with GT35R comp wheel. All ceramic coated for smooth flow. This should flow 50lbs/min of air. The old TO4B is at most 37lbs/min. As the TCD guys know, TCDs TO4E turbos have quick spool up and are less restrictive than most.
The manifold is next, again ceramic coated for better flow,
Im trying to have them installed in the next 2-3 weeks. I plan on dynoing the car with the existing system to see where Im at.
Currently the system is running about as well as it can. I finally mad progress on the boost controller. The Apex-I AVCR has never really worked properly. After ~2 years of frustration with it I removed it again and the revelation finally appeared to me. For some stupid reason I never removed the rubber plug from the NO port. It just never dawned on me that the seal this rubber plug had on the port was enough to not let air inflow to the wastegate, effectively sealing it. The pressure would build up and then mostly seal the wastegate closed and always overboost
The last year I was running it mannually. Now that its fully working and Im running a good tune @ 11.75:1 AFR @10.5psi on 91 octane. I may bump the timming up a bit from the current 14deg advance. The car feels real strong, in the ~320whp range. I believe if I put 94octane in it, it'll make ~340whp. Ill also have to install the 42lb inj's as the 32lbs are maxed out(90% DC).
Again, Ill dyno it in the next week and post results.
Stay tuned for install pics..
RussC
First is the turbo, TO4E, P-Trim exhaust wheel, 0.68 exhaust housing, 0.70 compressor housing with GT35R comp wheel. All ceramic coated for smooth flow. This should flow 50lbs/min of air. The old TO4B is at most 37lbs/min. As the TCD guys know, TCDs TO4E turbos have quick spool up and are less restrictive than most.
The manifold is next, again ceramic coated for better flow,
Im trying to have them installed in the next 2-3 weeks. I plan on dynoing the car with the existing system to see where Im at.
Currently the system is running about as well as it can. I finally mad progress on the boost controller. The Apex-I AVCR has never really worked properly. After ~2 years of frustration with it I removed it again and the revelation finally appeared to me. For some stupid reason I never removed the rubber plug from the NO port. It just never dawned on me that the seal this rubber plug had on the port was enough to not let air inflow to the wastegate, effectively sealing it. The pressure would build up and then mostly seal the wastegate closed and always overboost
The last year I was running it mannually. Now that its fully working and Im running a good tune @ 11.75:1 AFR @10.5psi on 91 octane. I may bump the timming up a bit from the current 14deg advance. The car feels real strong, in the ~320whp range. I believe if I put 94octane in it, it'll make ~340whp. Ill also have to install the 42lb inj's as the 32lbs are maxed out(90% DC).Again, Ill dyno it in the next week and post results.
Stay tuned for install pics..
RussC
Okay. I thought maybe they had to see a specific manifold and a specific turbo for the inspection.thesixerkid wrote:Shouldn't affect it at all. So long as the CARB sticker is there, Russ should be fine.wkohler wrote:Just curious how these two upgrades would affect the smog-legal status of the Dinan stuff.
I'm really interested to see some dyno results.
Again,
I say this alot, especially now here in CA with the test only stations, these guys dont care, they just want there $70!!!
Plus, what if the manifold cracks, you can't even get a replacement from Dinan anymore.
Dyno happens tomorrow in the PM PCT. Ill at least have the #s to post but maybe not the graphs.
RussC
I say this alot, especially now here in CA with the test only stations, these guys dont care, they just want there $70!!!
Plus, what if the manifold cracks, you can't even get a replacement from Dinan anymore.
Dyno happens tomorrow in the PM PCT. Ill at least have the #s to post but maybe not the graphs.
RussC
wkohler wrote:Okay. I thought maybe they had to see a specific manifold and a specific turbo for the inspection.thesixerkid wrote:Shouldn't affect it at all. So long as the CARB sticker is there, Russ should be fine.wkohler wrote:Just curious how these two upgrades would affect the smog-legal status of the Dinan stuff.
I'm really interested to see some dyno results.
I look forward to seeing the dyno charts. Seems like a very nice setup.
As far as smog issues. Technically speaking it is illegal to alter any part of the system or replace with other parts.
Will anyone care? Probably not.
I doubt that smog places will care that those things have been touched since the carb numbers are still there.
As far as smog issues. Technically speaking it is illegal to alter any part of the system or replace with other parts.
Will anyone care? Probably not.
I doubt that smog places will care that those things have been touched since the carb numbers are still there.
And this CARB cert was before the new rules where every piece of equipment had to be labeled with a permanent label with carb #. Now worries there.
Will post the dyno #s tonight.
RussC
Will post the dyno #s tonight.
RussC
misha wrote:I look forward to seeing the dyno charts. Seems like a very nice setup.
As far as smog issues. Technically speaking it is illegal to alter any part of the system or replace with other parts.
Will anyone care? Probably not.
I doubt that smog places will care that those things have been touched since the carb numbers are still there.
Dyno done...
And gees, I just cant will with this WG. While Im happy with the results, I just can't seem to find a setup with the WG that works everywhere. First, the dyno chart...
Um, the Apexi-AVCR and the WG wouldn't go higher than 7.7psi. On the street it runs 10.5psi to redline all day. Im sure its the heat in WG causing the spring to weaken, as Ive had this happen before. Im going to have to try to find a better setting on the WG that bridges the gap. The real solution is to get the Tial on the system I have setting in the garage. Plus DynoSpot has no fans except this little unit for the radiator. I got to find a dyno with MORE fan.
The best run was the last, I cranked the Apexi DC up to max and bumped timing up 2deg to 17 BTDC. With a whopping 0.7psi added and 2deg it bumped power 4hp and 10lb/ft. But the boost dropped to 6.8psi @ 5krpm, so all the hp gain was timing.
What Im real happy with is that the MAT max after 3 runs with virtually no cooling was 75C. And I had no detobation at all with 91 craptane. It would rise ~10C per run. I holly expected it to ping on the last run. Ambient was horribley hot @ 30C. That probably killed hp also.
Ill have time next week to dyno again and see where the limit really is with this setup and 91octane. Im pretty sure it can run ~11psi and maybe 20deg.
RussC
And gees, I just cant will with this WG. While Im happy with the results, I just can't seem to find a setup with the WG that works everywhere. First, the dyno chart...
Um, the Apexi-AVCR and the WG wouldn't go higher than 7.7psi. On the street it runs 10.5psi to redline all day. Im sure its the heat in WG causing the spring to weaken, as Ive had this happen before. Im going to have to try to find a better setting on the WG that bridges the gap. The real solution is to get the Tial on the system I have setting in the garage. Plus DynoSpot has no fans except this little unit for the radiator. I got to find a dyno with MORE fan.
The best run was the last, I cranked the Apexi DC up to max and bumped timing up 2deg to 17 BTDC. With a whopping 0.7psi added and 2deg it bumped power 4hp and 10lb/ft. But the boost dropped to 6.8psi @ 5krpm, so all the hp gain was timing.
What Im real happy with is that the MAT max after 3 runs with virtually no cooling was 75C. And I had no detobation at all with 91 craptane. It would rise ~10C per run. I holly expected it to ping on the last run. Ambient was horribley hot @ 30C. That probably killed hp also.
Ill have time next week to dyno again and see where the limit really is with this setup and 91octane. Im pretty sure it can run ~11psi and maybe 20deg.
RussC
It did for a long time, so I had boost pulled down to 8psi, but the AFRs were too high also. Now that I have it dailed to between 11.5-12.3AFR, it runs 10.5psi at 17deg to redline with no hint of detonation. On the street IC temps run max @ 10.5psi of ~34C. Thats why I tnink theres room for ~20deg @ 11psi. It appears the M30b35s give ~15whp/psi of boost intercooled. So 15x11=165whp above na whp of ~170whp. Thats right in 335whp range.
RussC
RussC
Shadow wrote:That sux, hope you get your wastegate fixed.
Does it ping on the street if you go over 15* @ only 10psi?
Umm,
Thats true if you have a W/A IC, even on a hot dyno. My A/A is limited to the ambient, and the IC was probably over 60C. Again, the car had no issues, so I was still operating within parameters that allowed the system work pretty well.
Thats what really sucks w/AA ICs, especially on a dyno with no fans to speak off. I need to find a dyno with alot more fan.
RussC
Thats true if you have a W/A IC, even on a hot dyno. My A/A is limited to the ambient, and the IC was probably over 60C. Again, the car had no issues, so I was still operating within parameters that allowed the system work pretty well.
Thats what really sucks w/AA ICs, especially on a dyno with no fans to speak off. I need to find a dyno with alot more fan.
RussC
turbodan wrote:75C for IAT's is pretty damn hot. I dont like seeing anything over 120. I like to see them under 90-100, or within 10 degrees of ambient. It makes a huge difference with my M20.
Well,
I made some log runs today and got the system pretty well tuned for my liking. I set the AFRs a little lower by just a bit and am real happy with the results. Plus I havent posted my maps so it seemed now was a good time. First the log..
Ive got it to run ~11.5AFRs @ 11psi. As you can see the PW is very high at 86% with just 32lbs injs. The car runs real strong. Its also getting to peak boost sooner with the timming map changes. And on a hot day like today, ~28C, thats really nice.
The WG works well here on the street as it peaks @ 179kPa and falls into a range of ~170kPa.
Um, does anybody else's boost signal look similar? As the boost flatens out, it oscillates from ~164kPa to 175kPa.? Im not sure if thats the oscillation of the Apex-I AVCR or not? Exhaust pulsations maybe?
That log should equate on a dyno of 310-320whp if I can every get the boost to hold on a dyno!
RussC
I made some log runs today and got the system pretty well tuned for my liking. I set the AFRs a little lower by just a bit and am real happy with the results. Plus I havent posted my maps so it seemed now was a good time. First the log..
Ive got it to run ~11.5AFRs @ 11psi. As you can see the PW is very high at 86% with just 32lbs injs. The car runs real strong. Its also getting to peak boost sooner with the timming map changes. And on a hot day like today, ~28C, thats really nice.
The WG works well here on the street as it peaks @ 179kPa and falls into a range of ~170kPa.
Um, does anybody else's boost signal look similar? As the boost flatens out, it oscillates from ~164kPa to 175kPa.? Im not sure if thats the oscillation of the Apex-I AVCR or not? Exhaust pulsations maybe?
That log should equate on a dyno of 310-320whp if I can every get the boost to hold on a dyno!
RussC
-
M. Holtmeier
- Posts: 3025
- Joined: Mar 11, 2007 3:06 AM
- Location: Dallas, Texas
In my case, its not the controller(now that I fixed it) its the WG.
No where yet, but at the house ready for the install. Id say very soon, 1 week. The mounting mechanism/position is really the stumbling block for me, still looking at options.
RussC
No where yet, but at the house ready for the install. Id say very soon, 1 week. The mounting mechanism/position is really the stumbling block for me, still looking at options.
RussC
grsmonkey wrote:Am I missing something with boost controllers? I have MS controlling boost with the GM fast acting valve and have never had any problems getting boost fast and holding it there.
On a lighter note; how are you liking your VIA carputer?
-
Justin535turbo
- Posts: 190
- Joined: Aug 09, 2008 12:59 AM
- Location: Alger, Wa
project
holy crap russ. that's quite a project. i'm about 90% done with mine at the moment.
-rebuilt b35 head
-flipped the dinan manifold upside down
-port matched the exhaust ports
-ceramic coated the manifold and turbo
-rebuilt the turbo
-larger front mount intercooler
-ARP head studs
-MLS head gasket
-BEGI 2025 FMU
i'm really hoping that it will still run alright with all these changes. i should be able to tune it enough using the FMU to keep myself in the safe range under boost. i think i'll just turn it up a little to about 15 pounds. i would post some pics, but i havent taken the time to mess with avatar yet. all i'm hoping for is 300 whp. i'm having it dyno'd after i'm done to make sure it's not leaning out, so i'll find out then.
-rebuilt b35 head
-flipped the dinan manifold upside down
-port matched the exhaust ports
-ceramic coated the manifold and turbo
-rebuilt the turbo
-larger front mount intercooler
-ARP head studs
-MLS head gasket
-BEGI 2025 FMU
i'm really hoping that it will still run alright with all these changes. i should be able to tune it enough using the FMU to keep myself in the safe range under boost. i think i'll just turn it up a little to about 15 pounds. i would post some pics, but i havent taken the time to mess with avatar yet. all i'm hoping for is 300 whp. i'm having it dyno'd after i'm done to make sure it's not leaning out, so i'll find out then.
Well,
I don't give up easy, dyno'd again today. Im happier but not satisfied. First, the chart..
I made progress on the WG, but I just don't know how to make the AVC-R work to my liking, so I give up. It gets pulled ASAP. No matter what I do in won't hold peak boost at all. I tried the changing feedback, peak boost and dutycyle to no avail. It would boost to 11.5psi but always fall back to 9.4psi. It just won't increase DC to hold the pressure, so the peak whp are no different in the last two runs. If the controller could have help 11psi, the whp would have been ~330whp.
The last run had a glitch and I don't know why, it didn't seem like a ping since the rest of the run went fine. The dyno AFR was reading 1.5 to 2.0AFR higher than LM1? I wasn't worried, as there was no detonation at all in any of the runs.
And, Im completely inj maxed. The last run gave 100% DC and would not hold 11.5AFR, it slowly rose as it did in the WBO2 chart shows to 12.4AFR by my log. I guess 300whp is max for 32lb inj's. I guess Im going to have to go to 55lb'rs.
Thats it for dyno's, Im going to install all my stuff now and see where were at sometime in late July/August.
Last note, the car now is making as much whp as Dinan quotes bhp on the Stg1 E34 turbo kit 8)
RussC
I don't give up easy, dyno'd again today. Im happier but not satisfied. First, the chart..
I made progress on the WG, but I just don't know how to make the AVC-R work to my liking, so I give up. It gets pulled ASAP. No matter what I do in won't hold peak boost at all. I tried the changing feedback, peak boost and dutycyle to no avail. It would boost to 11.5psi but always fall back to 9.4psi. It just won't increase DC to hold the pressure, so the peak whp are no different in the last two runs. If the controller could have help 11psi, the whp would have been ~330whp.
The last run had a glitch and I don't know why, it didn't seem like a ping since the rest of the run went fine. The dyno AFR was reading 1.5 to 2.0AFR higher than LM1? I wasn't worried, as there was no detonation at all in any of the runs.
And, Im completely inj maxed. The last run gave 100% DC and would not hold 11.5AFR, it slowly rose as it did in the WBO2 chart shows to 12.4AFR by my log. I guess 300whp is max for 32lb inj's. I guess Im going to have to go to 55lb'rs.
Thats it for dyno's, Im going to install all my stuff now and see where were at sometime in late July/August.
Last note, the car now is making as much whp as Dinan quotes bhp on the Stg1 E34 turbo kit 8)
RussC
Cant, the Air Research WG is so old(at least 25yrs), you can't get any parts for it anywhere, Ive tried. Thats why I cut the sping in it to work with the boost controller. It had a 11psi spring in it.
The problem now isn't the WG, it's the AVC-R. I wont adjust the DC properly to hold boost.
Thinking about it now, Im lucky it didn't hold boost, the AFRs would have skyrocketed and potentially caused catastophic failure....
RussC
The problem now isn't the WG, it's the AVC-R. I wont adjust the DC properly to hold boost.
Thinking about it now, Im lucky it didn't hold boost, the AFRs would have skyrocketed and potentially caused catastophic failure....
RussC
turbodan wrote:Might as well throw a .8 bar spring in the wastegate. No reason to run less boost than that, and it'd fix your boost taper issue.
My LM-1 also runs about two points off of the dyno WB. I cant remember if it was leaner or richer though. I tend to trust the dyno wideband more than the Innovative.